Do you think that the hoplophobes would still value backround checks if there was no gun information (ie make and serial) required on the form?
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Do you think that the hoplophobes would still value backround checks if there was no gun information (ie make and serial) required on the form?
Yes, any barrier to gun ownership is a good thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by milwaukeeshaker
Yes, its about the cost and inconvenience. It's really not about registration to these people (at least not the rank and file antis). Sure they want to register our guns (some know it eventually ends in confiscation but mostly because its a cost and inconvenience) but for the most part they're just happy spitting in the eye of their political opponents.Quote:
Originally Posted by milwaukeeshaker
As several here have said, these laws are nothing more than counting coup in the culture wars.
Then how come only 2.5% of the failures were arrested?Quote:
Originally Posted by OneGuy67
The failures may not be all warrant related. They may have an active restraining order in place, may have a conviction, etc. According to CBI Instacheck records, there were only 188 warrant arrests for 2013.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rucker61
From their statistics, a total of 396,955 transactions were conducted and 7,351 denials (1.81%). Of Concealed Handgun Permits, 63,178 eligible and 174 prohibited for 2013.
As Gman said in another thread, "Either enforce the laws or change them. This idea that we'll have all kinds of laws on the books and whomever is running the federal government at the time will selectively enforce them is lunacy"
What Gman said in that thread just confirms what I said earlier about perjury on the Form 4473's and no one seems to give a good shit about those violations. Apparently the threat of perjury is just a hopeful scare tactic. Either enforce/prosecute it or remove it from the forms...........[Mad]
You have to have something on the form and perjury is the easiest criminal charge that encompasses all potential issues, otherwise people will naturally claim they didn't know it was a crime. The Colorado Secretary of State uses a similar perjury statement on their website when people file documents. Perjury is a misdemeanor; however, the actual crime is forgery and is a felony, yet the Sec of State won't change their admonition to show the more serious offense. Should they take it off? No. It eliminates the possibility of a person who fraudulently files a document to claim they didn't know it was a crime to file a fraudulent document.
To this old fart, perjury is still perjury whether it is in a court of law or on an official document such as Form 4473.
As far as perjury goes, it always seemed rather strange that when person is found guilty in a trial and the guilty party had pleaded innocent to the charge but was actually proven guilty beyond ANY reasonable doubt, his lying about his being innocent apparently is never considered as perjury.
Ha! Good point Bob!
Joe Biden: 'We Don't Have Time To Prosecute Everybody Who Lies' On Background Checks
Quote:
So the Federal government wants to put more gun control legislation on the books, but they don't want to enforce the current laws. Barack Obama wants universal background checks on guns, but doesn't seem willing to do his job when it comes to enforcing the laws behind background checks. This came out during a meeting between Vice President Joe Biden and Jim Baker of the National Rifle Association. According to an interview that Baker gave with the Daily Caller, he said that Biden told him, "regarding the lack of prosecutions on lying on Form 4473s, we simply don’t have the time or manpower to prosecute everybody who lies on a form, that checks a wrong box, that answers a question inaccurately.”
There's no excuse for this. PERIOD. The Federal Government, Executive in particular, is selectively doing their job.Quote:
According to the Bureaus Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide, anyone submitting false information onATF Form 4473 commits a felony punishable by up to ten years in prison.
One would think that with the administration's call to "get the guns out of the hands of criminals," that they would be genuinely interested in prosecuting said criminals, but as reported earlier, this administration simply wants to go after guns. They are not interested in enforcing the law, which by the way, is their job as the Executive Branch.
In a report titled Enforcement of the Brady Act, 2010: Federal and State Investigations and Prosecutions of Firearm Applicants Denied by a NICS Check in 2010 that was authored by Ronald J. Frandsen and funded by tax payers through the U.S. Department of Justice and received in August of 2012, there was a report of 72,659 applications to purchase firearms that were denied (See Table A below).
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National Instant Criminal Background Check System reported that the most common reasons for denial fell into three categories. Thirty-four thousand four hundred fifty-nine denials for felony indictment or conviction were issued, making it 47.4% of the reason for denial of applications to purchase or transfer a firearm. Another 13,862 were denied because of being a fugitive, which amounted to 19.1% of denials. Finally, 7,666 people had their application denied because of State law prohibition, which made up 10.6% of denials.
In delayed denials, according to the report, "the agent contacts the firearm purchaser and seizes or takes an abandonment of the firearm or coordinates a transfer of the firearm to a licensed dealer or to a third party who is not a prohibited person. In POC states, a retrieval may be handled by local law enforcement, a statewide firearms unit, or ATF. In addition to the delayed denials, a small number of 2010 standard denials potentially involved unlawful firearm possession. Field offices investigated a total of 1,923 unlawful possession cases that began in 2010. A retrieval of a firearm (or firearms) from a prohibited person by field agents occurred in 1,164 (about 61%) of the cases. The subject of the investigation was cleared in 509 cases (approximately 27%). About 93% of the cases had been resolved by December 13, 2010, with the subject missing in nearly 7% of the cases."
However in the chart that follows that assessment, they indicate that 128 of those delayed denials they were unable to locate and 122 had other outcomes. Together they total 13% of delayed denials, which means that at the least a little over half of those still possess the firearm they acquired.
When it comes to actual prosecutions by U.S. attorneys, here's how the numbers break down. In Table 4 below these are the numbers of cases that the ATF declined to refer for prosecution and the reasons why.
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Table 5. shows a total of 62 cases in 2010 that ATF referred for prosecution. Note the reasons for the referral.
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Table. 6 shows that out of these 62, only 44 of those were prosecuted.
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The percentage of prosecutions based on the number of applicants is .00072879126%. That tells me that this process doesn't work and is likely not worth the tax dollars invested into it.