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FYI: I sent Magpul an email awhile back asking if colored PMags would be available before the July 1st deadline. I just received a response and here it is, straight from the horses' mouth:
"Colored PMags will not be available to Colorado buyers under the Airlift program, or through Magpul website before the deadline.
Sorry for the late reply..."
Bummer.
More upset about the AK mags not coming out till after the ban.
I really, really want some of those.
Wyoming is only a hop and a skip away.Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdown
Yup, you owned them while living in another city or family from another state gifted you. Remember its only illegal to purchase inside CO. Not illegal to own.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunner
HOUSE BILL 13-1224 [Digest]Quote:
Originally Posted by Madeinhb
BY REPRESENTATIVE(S) Fields, Court, Fischer, Hullinghorst, Labuda, Levy, Melton, Pabon, Rosenthal, Schafer, Williams, Young, Buckner, Ferrandino;
also SENATOR(S) Hodge, Aguilar, Guzman, Heath, Nicholson, Ulibarri, Morse.
AN ACTConcerning prohibiting large-capacity ammunition magazines.
Be it enacted by the General Assembly of the State of Colorado:
SECTION 1. In Colorado Revised Statutes, add part 3 to article 12 of title 18 as follows:
PART 3LARGE-CAPACITY AMMUNITION MAGAZINES18-12-301. Definitions. As used in this part 3, unless the context otherwise requires:
(1) "Bureau" means the Colorado bureau of investigation created and existing pursuant to section 24-33.5-401, C.R.S.
(2) (a) "Large-capacity magazine means:
(I) A fixed or detachable magazine, box, drum, feed strip, or similar device capable of accepting, or that is designed to be readily converted to accept, more than fifteen rounds of ammunition;
(II) A fixed, tubular shotgun magazine that holds more than twenty-eight inches of shotgun shells, including any extension device that is attached to the magazine and holds additional shotgun shells; or
(III) A nontubular, detachable magazine, box, drum, feed strip, or similar device that is capable of accepting more than eight shotgun shells when combined with a fixed magazine.
(b) "Large-capacity magazine" does not mean:
(I) A feeding device that has been permanently altered so that it cannot accommodate more than fifteen rounds of ammunition;
(II) An attached tubular device designed to accept, and capable of operating only with, .22 caliber rimfire ammunition; or
(III) A tubular magazine that is contained in a lever-action firearm.
18-12-302. Large-capacity magazines prohibited - penalties - exceptions. (1) (a) Except as otherwise provided in this section, on and after July 1, 2013, a person who sells, transfers, or possesses a large-capacity magazine commits a class 2 misdemeanor.
(b) Any person who violates subsection (1) of this section after having been convicted of a prior violation of said subsection (1) commits a class 1 misdemeanor.
(c) Any person who violates subsection (1) of this section commits a class 6 felony if the person possessed a large-capacity magazine during the commission of a felony or any crime of violence, as defined in section 18-1.3-406.
(2) (a) A person may possess a large-capacity magazine if he or she:
(I) Owns the large-capacity magazine on the effective date of this section; and
(II) Maintains continuous possession of the large-capacity magazine.
(b) If a person who is alleged to have violated subsection (1) of this section asserts that he or she is permitted to legally possess a large-capacity magazine pursuant to paragraph (a) of this subsection (2), the prosecution has the burden of proof to refute the assertion.
(3) The offense described in subsection (1) of this section shall not apply to:
(a) An entity, or any employee thereof engaged in his or her employment duties, that manufactures large-capacity magazines within Colorado exclusively for transfer to, or any licensed gun dealer, as defined in section 12-26.1-106 (6), C.R.S., or any employee thereof engaged in his or her official employment duties, that sells large-capacity magazines exclusively to:
(I) A branch of the armed forces of the United States;
(II) A department, agency, or political subdivision of the state of Colorado, or of any other state, or of the United States government;
(III) A firearms retailer for the purpose of firearms sales conducted outside the state;
(IV) A foreign national government that has been approved for such transfers by the United States government; or
(V) An out-of-state transferee who may legally possess a large-capacity magazine; or
(b) An employee of any of the following agencies who bears a firearm in the course of his or her official duties:
(I) A branch of the armed forces of the United States; or
(II) A department, agency, or political subdivision of the state of Colorado, or of any other state, or of the United States government; or
(c) A person who possesses the magazine for the sole purpose of transporting the magazine to an out-of-state entity on behalf of a manufacturer of large-capacity magazines within Colorado.
18-12-303. Identification markings for large-capacity magazines - rules. (1) A large-capacity magazine that is manufactured in Colorado on or after the effective date of this section must include a permanent stamp or marking indicating that the large-capacity magazine was manufactured or assembled after the effective date of this section. The stamp or marking must be legibly and conspicuously engraved or cast upon the outer surface of the large-capacity magazine.
(2) The bureau may promulgate such rules as may be necessary for the implementation of this section, including but not limited to rules requiring a large-capacity magazine that is manufactured on or after the effective date of this section to bear identifying information in addition to the identifying information described in subsection (1) of this section.
(3) A person who manufactures a large-capacity magazine in Colorado in violation of subsection (1) of this section commits a class 2 misdemeanor and shall be punished in accordance with section 18-1.3-501.
SECTION 2. Effective date. This act takes effect July 1, 2013.
SECTION 3. Safety clause. The general assembly hereby finds, determines, and declares that this act is necessary for the immediate preservation of the public peace, health, and safety.
Approved: March 20, 2013
100% unenforceable. In order for this to be enforceable the state would have to require all magazines owned prior to the ban be serialized and registered, any magazines not serialized and registered by a certain date would be prohibited. Since there is no serial number or date stamp there is no way for a police officer to know whether or not your magazine was bought after the ban.Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
Many lawyers who have reviewed this law say this is one of the worst written pieces of legislation in Colorado history and believe it won't be enforced due to the fact that any decent defense attorney will be able to have any possession charge thrown out of court.
Magpul magazines are date stamped and this was the specific brand of magazine the OP posted about. When the magazine in your possession is stamped 08/13 you'd better have an attorney on retainer.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDee
That's just it. Maybe this law is unenforceable, maybe it isn't. PMags do have a date stamp right where a lightening hole should be, however it would really s*ck to be the test case.
Magpul, if they really wanted to stick it to CO should have a military production line and a civvy line, one with cage codes and date stamps and one without. That would make me really happy.
It has been posted many times but no one seems to understand that magpul stamps all of their mags with month and year of manufacture, its the clock looking thing, and if you think you can just scrape it off and all is good you are again wrong, you will be automatically guilty, no questions asked. You had better believe that the state knows that magpul mags are marked and will be looking for them. Now if magpul were to stop marking them then all would be good, other than ak mags as they will no be produced until after the ban.
The big problem for the AK mags is if they are not released to the public until after July 1. Then, LEO's will know you didn't have it prior to the effective date of the law, unless you can get a letter from Magpul saying they sold/gave you them prior to release for testing.
Do you feel safer knowing cops are going to be spending their time (aka your money) checking date stamps on pieces of plastic? If I was a cop 0% of my attention would go to enforcing this.
If Colorado enforces this magazine ban like other states enforced theirs, then repair of preban magazines should still be completely legal. The solution to getting the colored magazines you want will be to simply rebuild your preban magazines with new bodies and floorplates in the desired color.Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb
Reminds me of the Ship of Theseus.
So we'll be able to replace the mag bodies even though they'll be dated stamped after the law goes into effect. In other states, can you replace every part making it a completely new magazine? I guess only time will tell.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingman
You can in California. There are a good number of online retailers who even sell a full "rebuild kit."Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
They will have to stop marking them before the effective date of the law for that to work too .. since if it is " common knowledge" they stopped date stamping after X date then an un marked mag would be known to have been produced after that date.Quote:
Originally Posted by dirtrulz
You guys need to visit the magpul Custom Shop. Any color pmag is at your fingertips
http://ts3.mm.bing.net/th?id=H.49859...11690&pid=15.1
Wish I could agree but the logic does not work in all circumstances such as these Magpul AK mags. For the same reason NONE of us will ever own a legal full auto PS90 we will not own Magpul AK mags since they will only be available AFTER the deadline.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDee
I so wish I were wrong about this!
Now if we 3D print them.... That is another matter ;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hound
Speak for yourself. With the right paperwork 1 of anything is legal. I wouldn't waste it on a PS90, but hey that's me.
That is exactly what the situation is in California. You can replace every single part of your old magazine with new parts and it is still legally your old magazine. To be legal you have to do the replacement in stages, so if zero parts were interchangeable between magazines it wouldn't work. But say you had a preban USGI magazine. You could take it apart, keep the spring, and then rebuild the magazine around that spring with a PMAG body, follower, and baseplate. You could then rebuild that magazine by putting the PMAG spring into it. You end up with a 100% new PMAG magazine in a configuration that didn't exist before the ban, that is legally considered preban.Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
A big difference between California and Colorado is that they have the CalGuns Foundation and we have nothing remotely similar. CGF isn't really a lobbying organization like RMGO, they are more of a legal advocacy group for the right to bear arms. CGF has been behind forcing courts and the DOJ to clarify what exactly the law means, and then advising the California gun community how they can fully exercise their rights and stay within the law. CGF also makes a sort of "implied promise" that if someone follows CGF recommendations and still ends up being prosecuted for breaking the law, then CGF will step forward for their legal defense. Once CGF says something is within the law they will aggressively fight to stop precedent being set anywhere to the contrary in the state.
CGF doesn't take on everything and they make it clear what their limits are. For example, "open carry" is technically legal in California but CGF doesn't get involved there. It is an area of the law where they don't want to spend their money and time.
It is largely due to CGF that Californians are able to have AR-15s at all, and largely due to CGF that things like off-list lowers, monsterman grips, bullet buttons, and magazine rebuilds have been figured out.
Like I wrote, Colorado has nothing that remotely resembles CGF.
That assumes that people can think outside the box. That thinking is outdated.Quote:
Originally Posted by jim
Believe it or not, I picked up 4 FDE gen2 Pmags at Sportsman's Warehouse just last week.
I thought I was seeing an illusion!
See my rewrites. CA just took one of the last steps over the lemming highway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingman
Whuch is one reason why there has been so much Panic Buying. Failure to plan and understand what has been at stake for a few decades. Failure to adapt when what you want is not an option, failure to as you said, "Think outside the Box"Quote:
Originally Posted by hatidua
Board members here and elsewhere, have no problem kryloning a $2K AR because they wanted a FDE, it's a 6 month waiT and THEY WANT IT NOW! . Suggest the same folks drop $4.99 and paint theIr MAGS and folks have a melt down. SPRAY PAINT MAGPUL MAGAZINES, R U NUTZ ? ? ? ? ?
As Mr. Ford said in the last century, Any color as long as it's BLACK
I just received 20 round Pmags in FDE from Brownell's and I don't see a date stamp on them just a clock like stamp that I don't know how to decifer.Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
That would be the manufacture date. The number in center is the year and the hand of the clock is pointing at the month.
Thanks for the clarification!Quote:
Originally Posted by dirtrulz
not to nickpick, but just an FYI, Open carry of a sidearm was recently prohibited in CA. I agree with you CGF is awesome they defended an inlaw of mine pro bono. got him some cash too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingman