308 vs 300win mag

im looking into buying my first precision rifle im pretty much settled on the remington 700s because it seems like the aftermarket loves them but should i be looking for one in 308 or 300? most of my shooting will be at my house (600yd range) but i really want to be able to stretch out to 1000+ ill also be going elk hunting with it next year if that matters and ill be reloading for this setup

also ill be wanting to run a shorter barrel 22" or so but from my research this wont really effect either caliber

If you want to shoot a lot get the 308.

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Originally Posted by newracer

If you want to shoot a lot get the 308.

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from my research reloading makes 300 not all that expensive

I'd agree on the 308. Until you linked hunting in there I would have recommended one of the 6.5mm flavors, still would if you are comfortable making a good hit. Of the two .30 cal listed, 308 for general target use and maybe hunting.

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from my research reloading makes 300 not all that expensive

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Agreed, increase is the extra powder once invested in brass. I think the delta is that it'd be less comfortable to shoot alot.

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Originally Posted by cofi

from my research reloading makes 300 not all that expensive

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He's talking about recoil. The 300WM has a LOT more recoil than the 308Win. Granted, I haven't fired either, but that's what I've run across the most often in my research.

For the record, I will be buying a Remington 700 5R 24" 308Win within the next month. Was originally going to get an SPS Varmint, but I was swayed by some people here to start out with a good base. And FYI, the 5R comes in a 20" with threaded barrel. It also comes in 300WM.

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Originally Posted by merl

I think the delta is that it'd be less comfortable to shoot alot.

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How well do muzzle breaks mitigate the recoil? My only experience with them has been with 223 where they don't really do much

They do work for recoil with the penalty of increased blast/sound. (based on a .50)

If you are going for long range precision go with something in the 6mm world.

If your going to do a 300 - then why not a WSM (you increase your barrel life and then you can do a short action).

There is a minor increase in felt recoil going from .308 to .300 - but put your big girl pants on and deal with it.

That said - all my 30 cal precision guns are in .308. But I think that's more of a historic reason than anything else.

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Originally Posted by asmo

If your going to do a 300 - then why not a WSM (you increase your barrel life and then you can do a short action).

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I haven't done any research on the wsm I'm off to Google around for a bit

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Originally Posted by asmo

If you are going for long range precision go with something in the 6mm world.

If your going to do a 300 - then why not a WSM (you increase your barrel life and then you can do a short action).

There is a minor increase in felt recoil going from .308 to .300 - but put your big girl pants on and deal with it.

That said - all my 30 cal precision guns are in .308. But I think that's more of a historic reason than anything else.

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I like the idea of the 300 WSM as well. Short action, 7-10% less powder than the 300 Win Mag, darn close to the same performance up to 180 grain bullets... 10 feet less drop at 1,000 (vs .308).... no stupid belt on the cartridge (better bore alignment, potentially longer lasting brass, smoother feeding). The cost? One less round in the magazine.

7mm WSM is also pretty damn impressive. Check this guy's rig out...

http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek064.html

I have and shoot both calibers. A brake is a must on a 300WM. And the recoil is more than a slight extra. It is approx double the powder and usually slinging a 25-30% heavier pill.

Both are easy for ten rounds, or for hunting. But try to have fun shooting a 300WM 80 rounds in a couple hours in just a t-shirt. Easy in a 308. Good luck after 20-40 rounds in a row through the magnum.

The 308 is capable to 1000, or a little over. So long as your wind is consistent. The 300WM gets you a couple hundred additional yards and better resistance to the wind at 1000.

I was talking about recoil. I have a 300 WM for elk hunting, I am a pretty big guy and can handle some recoil but after 4-6 rounds I start flinching. I recently picked up a 308, haven't shot it much yet but the one time I did I was fine after 20 rounds.

Frankly, dumping the belt for the .300 WSM is a good idea in my opinion. Reloading .300 Win Short Mag is a much easier process than .300 Win Mag.

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Originally Posted by J

I have and shoot both calibers. A brake is a must on a 300WM. And the recoil is more than a slight extra. It is approx double the powder and usually slinging a 25-30% heavier pill.

Both are easy for ten rounds, or for hunting. But try to have fun shooting a 300WM 80 rounds in a couple hours in just a t-shirt. Easy in a 308. Good luck after 20-40 rounds in a row through the magnum.

The 308 is capable to 1000, or a little over. So long as your wind is consistent. The 300WM gets you a couple hundred additional yards and better resistance to the wind at 1000.

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so a muzzle brake dosent bring the 300 back down to 308 levels of recoil?

No. I have a brake on my mag and not on my 308. I can shoot 100rds easily on my 308 in a trip. I've rarely want to go over 20-30 on the mag.

I feel 300wm is better utilized at 1200+ yds or for hunting at extended distances. Have you thought about 6.5 Creedmoor or 260rem? They provide 300wm like trajectory. I would still want .308 to shoot though. Might not be the best performing round but the amount of info on it is unbeatable and still reasonably accurate within 1000yds.

308.

I'd have a .300 WM, but not as my only precision rifle. If I could only have one, it would be a .308. Even better would be something more ballistically efficient in the 6.5mm family.

I'm not a hunter, though, so take my opinion for what it's worth.

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Originally Posted by cofi

so a muzzle brake dosent bring the 300 back down to 308 levels of recoil?

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The right brake makes them very easy to shoot, but everyone around you isn't going to like it.

APA Fat Bastard would be the brake I'd run on a 300 WM. It's big, but it works wonderfully.

As to 300 WSM, I'd build one off a long action so you can mag feed the longer high BC bullets and not sacrifice case capacity.

For the OP, the key words I see is First Precision Rifle go with the 308, or something like a 260, 6.5 CM ect.

.308. Hands down.

Then you can switch it into something compatible after the first barrel burns up at around 10k-15k rounds.

i like the .260 Remington.

.308

I've hit 1400 yards a few times. 175 gr's still fly straight (no tumbling) at those distances.

I have over 3K rounds through mine and it still out shoots me every time.

[Beer]

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Originally Posted by XC700116

The right brake makes them very easy to shoot, but everyone around you isn't going to like it.

APA Fat Bastard would be the brake I'd run on a 300 WM. It's big, but it works wonderfully.

As to 300 WSM, I'd build one off a long action so you can mag feed the longer high BC bullets and not sacrifice case capacity.

For the OP, the key words I see is First Precision Rifle go with the 308, or something like a 260, 6.5 CM ect.

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Of course, you're right. He should start with a .308. It's to fun to ponder other fun stuff though...

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Originally Posted by Zombie Steve

Of course, you're right. He should start with a .308. It's to fun to ponder other fun stuff though...

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Yes, it is fun, (And I'm making no assumptions on OP's experience here) it's just that I am working with a friend of mine that can't even zero his shiny new Tika T3 Superlite in 300 WM. Dropped the cash for a nice rifle, and a really nice Swaro on top of it. But since he's new to big rifles he's all over the place because he has no clue how to manage recoil, or any of the fundamentals. The only rifles he has owned or shot before are AR's, and he bought this one on a whim without asking anyone but the guy at the sales counter if it was a good idea. So now I'm trying to teach him those things on a monster caliber, in a very light rifle, and it's not going well. He of course is trying to be stubborn about it and doesn't want to learn it on one of my rifles. Thankfully he's finally picking up a 270 from his uncle that will be a lot easier to shoot so hopefully I can get him squared away using that. This is why when I don't have a good background on people I usually recommend non magnum short actions in cheap calibers to shoot for their first bolt guns. Personally I don't have a lot of love for 308 ballistics but it's advantages for getting a lot of trigger time without torching your barrel or your wallet make it an obviously great choice.

I have shot bolt guns and various other rifles for years (mostly hunting and screwing around) and just this fall put together my first long range custom built rig and got into match shooting. I leaned on Tim K's knowledge and willingness to help heavily while getting that rifle together and he was very helpful. I'm extremely happy with the rifle and I'm shooting well with it, I'm pretty sure he'd have slapped me upside the head if I'd have gone through that whole thing with intentions on building a 300 WM or other big magnum caliber.

IMO it's tough to combine a precision rig and a hunting rig into the same rifle and have something you're willing to pack around while hunting and have something that's nice to shoot for long strings of fire on the line, practicing or shooting a match. Right now I'm rebuilding my hunting rifle into more of a precision rig for hunting, but I don't see myself shooting long strings of fire with it either, as it's going to be as light as I can make it within my constraints for a precision shooter, It's getting EXPENSIVE.

In reality, you're much better served by building/buying a good precision rifle for LR shooting/practice and matches, and buying an off the shelf magnum hunting rifle for hunting with low round counts and quite frankly, you don't need 1/2 MOA for hunting at reasonable ranges.

Cofi, get a .308, if you wanna shoot both let me know, I load for both and mostly end up using my .308. For hunting its gonna be all about shot placement, but .308 will get it done! .308 is a little cheaper to load for also, lighter pills, not quit but almost half the powder. I hunted 3 years with a 14lb .300wm and decided enough was enough and am building a 6.5x284 Norma now mostly just to hunt game and bigger critters. Running my Win Mag suppressed brings it down to a .308.