Orthodontics: I'm in the wrong business.

Okay, so I think I have got this figured out.

Got 4 kids between the two of us. The other sperm/egg donors are pretty much deadbeats. either content to be unemployed or underemployed and collect a paycheck for the children.

But anyways, on to the topic.

Over the next 4 years I will have paid the damn Orthodontic Office $15K for work on the children after insurance. AND that is having TWO major insurances!

I am in the wrong business. It seems as though All I have to do is be a ortho dentist, get in real good with a local family dentist to get them to "refer families to my practice" because, "if they don't get this overcrowding taken care of BAD things will happen" and "you can make the check out to: ..." Glue some wires on the teeth, for 2 - 3 years and voila!


[facepalm]


Ohh! did I mention while all this is going on ... just hire some hot orthodontic assistants to walk around in my office in scrubs?

Hey only 4 years of under grad. Then 4 years of dental school. Then 2-3 years of ortho residency =)

Amen, the ortho we took our kid to wanted to put them on for 2 years now and then probably another 2yrs when she turns 16. He said the first set may or may not fix the issue. WTF? If it doesn't fix it, I shouldn't have to pay for it. He didn't like that remark.

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Originally Posted by vossman

Amen, the ortho we took our kid to wanted to put them on for 2 years now and then probably another 2yrs when she turns 16. He said the first set may or may not fix the issue. WTF? If it doesn't fix it, I shouldn't have to pay for it. He didn't like that remark.

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I'm not happy with dentists right now... Just averted the Dental surgeon screwing up one of their mouth's forever. Because the regular dental assistant filled out the referral paperwork wrong on what tooth (baby tooth) needed to be extracted, they almost took out a baby tooth AND the tooth under it. Good thing the wife paid attention otherwise my kid would be without one canine permanently.

My oldest is going to be a snaggle tooth. Already is a bit. I keep hoping I run into an orthodontist with a passion for restoring a German car who is willing to trade.

Yep, getting ready to send my daughter in, and was supposed to send in my son already. Now the dentist says my daughter should go first because of an issue with crowding a tooth. $100 month for each kid for 2 years. insurance pays the rest. (mostly I hope)

I would rather trust used car salesman than physicians or dentists.
Lowest echelon.

(no offense to physicians or dentists here)

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Originally Posted by DEAGLER

Hey only 4 years of under grad. Then 4 years of dental school. Then 2-3 years of ortho residency =)

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Get paid for you residency by going into the service...that's what my old man did, but it was in periodontics....His good friend was an ortho, and guy is a multimillionaire...

thats generally because used car salesmen don't get sued for millions of dollars if they make a mistake and usually don't accrue 300k in loans to start their career.

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Originally Posted by MrPrena

I would rather trust used car salesman than physicians or dentists.
Lowest echelon.

(no offense to physicians or dentists here)

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Originally Posted by buckshotbarlow

Get paid for you residency by going into the service...that's what my old man did, but it was in periodontics....His good friend was an ortho, and guy is a multimillionaire...

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What my dentist did, several years of Air force, great guy, top notch work. Refers only to the top notch orthodontics folks.

Few yrs ago, I had to have an emergency root canal. As I'm sitting there looking out at his brand new AMG that I'll be paying the note on, I ask how many he does a year? He told me, I did the math. $280K a yr. not a bad business.

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Originally Posted by Limited GM

Few yrs ago, I had to have an emergency root canal. As I'm sitting there looking out at his brand new AMG that I'll be paying the note on, I ask how many he does a year? He told me, I did the math. $280K a yr. not a bad business.

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That's just for that one procedure as well.

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Originally Posted by Limited GM

Few yrs ago, I had to have an emergency root canal. As I'm sitting there looking out at his brand new AMG that I'll be paying the note on, I ask how many he does a year? He told me, I did the math. $280K a yr. not a bad business.

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Don't forget the Assistants! In Scrubs!

And to think they aren't even union!

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Originally Posted by Limited GM

Few yrs ago, I had to have an emergency root canal. As I'm sitting there looking out at his brand new AMG that I'll be paying the note on, I ask how many he does a year? He told me, I did the math. $280K a yr. not a bad business.

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It isn't like that is take home money. Not saying they dont make good money but that procedure has to pay for rent, how many people in support, payroll tax, utilities, all the medical equipment (and as much of a tool whore as I am dentists put me to shame) and a few other things I am forgetting.

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Originally Posted by tmleadr03

It isn't like that is take home money. Not saying they dont make good money but that procedure has to pay for rent, how many people in support, payroll tax, utilities, all the medical equipment (and as much of a tool whore as I am dentists put me to shame) and a few other things I am forgetting.

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you're forgetting osha...my dad's arch nemesis...

Damn, I haven't been to the dentist in a few years... I need to get in there soon. Hopefully my dental coverage at my new job kicks in soon, so I can finally get a check up.

have 1 kid now, probably another before too long. looking forward to these bills....

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Originally Posted by tmleadr03

It isn't like that is take home money. Not saying they dont make good money but that procedure has to pay for rent, how many people in support, payroll tax, utilities, all the medical equipment (and as much of a tool whore as I am dentists put me to shame) and a few other things I am forgetting.

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I didn't say it was. Every business has expense, but that career beats the hell outta throwing papers. Or any career of anyone in my circle of shooters.

i cant believe they make you guys get in the plan like a lawyer on retainer

i got mine straightened when i was 25, $4200 cash no insurance, metal came off in 18 months, extremely quick if you look at my before and after, 4 sets of invisialign after that for final adjustments and as retainers for permanent position, all included in the price. they had to re-attatch 2 different times a bracket, one i broke eating steak (prohibited during brackets process), broke a wire too, no charge. i have another follow up on current set of invisialigns next month, still no charge.

i dont work for them nor do i get cash back. just want to pass along a good ortho

unterseher ortho 104th & federal


eta: wanna see before pics? worse than a possum done chewing through ball bearings

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Originally Posted by Limited GM

I didn't say it was. Every business has expense, but that career beats the hell outta throwing papers. Or any career of anyone in my circle of shooters.

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A lot of professions require a great deal of start up costs. Dentist is one of them. Typically what I have found is the higher the cost to get started the higher the rewards after. Whether that be in tools, education or both.

As people mentioned before, even if they do $1200/day average (which is fairly up the ladder) , that will make it total revenue of ~$440k.

Company/Corporate costs:
-Rent
-Utilities
-Insurances
-payroll (incl taxes)
-marketing
-Equipment payments
-etc etc etc etc etc

After they pay themselves, they gotta pay student loans (if they had a loan) which can be high as average household mortgage.
Oh yeah, that dentist who bought an MB x63 AMG , he needs to pay the payments on that too.


ETA: Better than how I make money. :(

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Originally Posted by MrPrena

As people mentioned before, even if they do $1200/day average (which is fairly up the ladder) , that will make it total revenue of ~$440k.

Company/Corporate costs:
-Rent
-Utilities
-Insurances
-payroll (incl taxes)
-marketing
-Equipment payments
-etc etc etc etc etc

After they pay themselves, they gotta pay student loans (if they had a loan) which can be high as average household mortgage.
Oh yeah, that dentist who bought an MB x63 AMG , he needs to pay the payments on that too.

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Easiest way to think about it is if they make (gross profit) 15 cents for every dollar coming through the door they are kicking ass.

ETA: The accountant told me last week that I made 23 cents on every dollar I took in the door this last year. Of course this is Gross Profit, and doesn't take into account all the equipment and tools I purchased to do business. With that taken into account I didn't make a cent and in fact went negative.

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Originally Posted by tmleadr03

Easiest way to think about it is if they make (gross profit) 15 cents for every dollar coming through the door they are kicking ass.

ETA: The accountant told me last week that I made 23 cents on every dollar I took in the door this last year. Of course this is Gross Profit, and doesn't take into account all the equipment and tools I purchased to do business. With that taken into account I didn't make a cent and in fact went negative.

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Who is John Galt. Corporate tax doesn't help either (for net income/common).

23% gross profit is not bad at all. Even semi-conductor companies are averaging 35%ish.
It just proves how hard it is for dentists to make $$$.

Best job right now is to just make apps ,just like WhatsApp.

they lease those expensive cars to write off too right?

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Originally Posted by Persocon

they lease those expensive cars to write off too right?

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Kinda. The way you do it is create a business. Buy a car through that business. Then lease that car to yourself. You are responsible for the monthly payments. The business is responsible for the taxes, which are now a business expense and can be written off. You get to write off the lease payments as a business expense as well.

As with anything, proper preparation and hard work can have its rewards. Some of my childhood friends and even friends from the service are envious of my financial position (I'm no Larry Ellison but I'm comfortable). What they usually ignore is how I worked my rear off in high school and college to get the education that put me in the position I'm in today. They also ignore how I wasn't one of the ones spending $20-40/wk on beer or girls or how I spent a cool $15+K of my own money on my master's degree or the years I spent working 80+ hours/wk or the fact my car is now 15 years old with splits in the seats. All they can see now are the cool laptop, vacations, etc.

We often envy doctors or dentists or what have you because they can define their own schedules (sort of) and usually have good financial positions later in life. We forget little things like years of education, malpractice insurance, residencies, medical waste expenses, etc. My grandfather quit practicing medicine in his 50s because he realized he made more money from his investments than his practice but before that he was used to getting paid in chickens or cuts of meat or whatever people could scrape together. He also had the "fun" of being an admitting physician right after the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor (something he never talked about and we only discovered after his death).

Personally, I don't want to spend half my waking life in another person's mouth even for the kind of cash dentists and orthodontists make. I'm glad they don't charge more than they do because it would take a heckuva lot more to get me to do that job.

I figure out the same thing when I pulled into my dentist's office and there was a brand new Audi R8 Convertible parked out front.

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Originally Posted by Limited GM

I didn't say it was. Every business has expense, but that career beats the hell outta throwing papers. Or any career of anyone in my circle of shooters.

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Don't know about that.. last thing I want to do with my life is dig around in some nasty slobs mouth all day.



sent from a soup can and some string..

Wow- sounds like fun, 11-12 years of school after high school, debt of 400-500k from school, practice debt of 700k and now you complain the guy doesn't work enough for it?!?! You sound like a jealous liberal.....

Where did he say he wasn't working enough for it?

I got braces late in life, My orthodontist is a really cool guy. But he is always telling me I need to come and check out his air planes and I leave like this :( then I walk past his Porsche then am really like :( LOL

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Originally Posted by Geology Rocks

I figure out the same thing when I pulled into my dentist's office and there was a brand new Audi R8 Convertible parked out front.

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Um. was his Audi R8 Spyder a V8? or V10? [ROFL1]