I was thinking about where to put a couple 55 gallon drums of H2O. Will a 55g plastic drum freeze and fail if I left it outside thru the winter? Multiple winters? Anyone store water like that?
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I was thinking about where to put a couple 55 gallon drums of H2O. Will a 55g plastic drum freeze and fail if I left it outside thru the winter? Multiple winters? Anyone store water like that?
They will fail over several winters at the seam. Fill to 80% or they may fail the first winter.
Do you not have space for them inside?
Well, my wife thinks I'm a crazy person for wanting to have a big bag of rice, beans, and some extra canned goods as it is (maybe 2 weeks worth). I tried to get her to read One Second After, but that didn't work (Her exact words, no joke: "I'd rather die than live in a world like that."). So, needless to say, I'm trying to stock up on stuff on the down low. So if something happens, we're covered. Not to segue, but if you've got any advice on that too, it'd be extremely helpful.
Example: The other night we had a power outage at about 20:30, and while she was using her phone to wander around the house, I pulled out a couple candles. She said "That's a great idea!".. At that point I thought it'd be a good opportunity to explain why I'm doing what I'm doing. She thought I was joking. lol
I may be able to hide a couple water containers in the utility room, behind some boxes or something, I'll get dimensions and see what I can come up with.
Kerosene hurricane lanterns can be at Walmart for about $5. They make big and small, but the wick, and therefore the flame, is the same size so you get the same light with a small one.
I think I can help with the communication aspects a bit. There are many women that don't accept the TEOTWAWKI premise. It's just too big and fantastical. However, tackling the problem in smaller bite-sized situations may be the way to go. Weather-related incidents often result in power loss, for an extended period of time. Look at what has recently happened in Evergreen (I think?)- they're without power for a week because one power pole went down. Wildfires and house fires are another real possibility. A loss of income is another- what if one of you was injured on the job, or lost a job? You've got to start out slow. An extra case of water, for instance. A good price on canned beans equals a few more added to the stockpile. Baby steps in response to genuine problem prevention is the way to approach it. I read One Second After, and it's a bit extreme. The women I know aren't going to be turned prepper because of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Delvehound
Adjust how you present it to her. She obviously connects prepping with the apocalypse. However, there are a lot of levels. Putting a pair of boots and a coat in the trunk during winter is prepping, but most might consider it simple common sense. You need to identify what lower level situations she may see as possible, and prep for that. Over time, she will likely become comfortable with those things and you and find reason to add another. Hiding the purchase costs as well as the items purchased is very difficult. You already know that going whole hog on preps will get you shut down.Quote:
Originally Posted by Delvehound
It just isn't practical/possible for one half of the team to prep while the other half ridicules the efforts. There are plenty of issues even when both sides agree. My wife still has a habit of pulling from the set backs when we run out of something with the intention of replacing it, but then procrastinates/forgets. I come along months later to inventory and find storage has reduced instead of increased. While I appreciate the "oh sorry, I intended to replace it, blah blah" it is still frustrating.
Does she like frugal shopping? Encourage her to buy extra food when it's on sale. To save money over the course of the year
Water in bottles in the back unused space makes the fridge and freezer run more efficiently. And keep cold wthout power. Distilled water for the car batteries and the iron.
A hot tub would be a source of un treated water and an excuse for pool shock. A pond? A second water heater inline adds efficiency to the system 50 gallons extra...
Have a box of "camping food". The headlamps you need for working on the car or in the crawl space... speaking of crawl space its likely got lots of room.
Like Irving said with lamps. Also tiki torches for parties and citronellla. Propane for the bbq a couple of extra tanks cause you hate running out when the steaks are on. An extra tank for the mower. Same reasons. Seperate tank for the weed eater.
Thanks for all the replies! I do have her to the point where if canned goods are on a good sale, we buy a few extra. It's the few extra on top of the few extra where I get the look. Do you remember when you were a kid, trying to sneak goodies in the cart, hoping your mom didn't see? Same situation LOL
I'll adjust the way I present it to her, and use actual real-life situations, folks are going thru as examples. I have her on board for a week or two worth of extras, but we're not prepared if we lose water, heat, or more than a couple days electricity... Come to think of it we're screwed, unless something happens in the rainy season, and folks keep the peace in old Aurora... I just ran out of propane last weekend (all three tanks), I'm out of gas mowing the lawn, I've got a small amount of Kerosene, but that'll be gone from the garage heater come winter, and I shoot more than I buy/reload. Looks like I'm going to have a busy weekend while the wife is at work. LOL
There is a lot of good advice in this thread, and it will be EXTREMELY important that you onboard your wife at a pace that will be unnoticed by her as anything but normal. Let's say for example that she loves you very much and just gives in and says, "I think you're being silly, but do what you want." While you may be excited by having gotten a green light, she'll be telling ALL her friends what a weirdo you've turned into and it's a good thing she loves you so much. The BEST case scenario for however those conversations play out is probably not at all anything you will want to deal with now, or in the future.
We don't know your wife at all, so you'll really have to try different tactics to find a good fit. I'm a big fan of pointing the finger at other people and saying, "Man, I sure don't want to be THAT guy!" This works very well for people clearing store shelves before weather moves in, or even people fighting over the latest toy on Christmas Eve. All it takes is a positive experience to get the ball rolling. If you convince your wife that you guys should start buying Christmas presents now, (better prices, less pressure, more inventory, spread out the cost load) and are successful by having the least stressful Christmas in memory, you've made a giant leap toward your goal, all by completing an exercise that your wife will likely never relate to prepping. "Oh man, aren't you glad we got all the shopping done early? I can't believe how much more enjoyable this holiday season has been."
Being prepared for the holidays months ahead is the exact same principle as being prepared for anything months ahead. The propane idea someone mentioned is perfect. Maybe one day you run out of deodorant and it throws off your whole day, so when you come home from Costco with a 5 pack of Speed Stick, 52 razors, 5 toothpastes, 3 Q-tips, and 20 bars of soap saying, "I NEVER want to have a crappy day like that again just because I wasn't paying attention," it might seem like an over reaction at first, but after 6 months of not having run out of any toiletries, she may get used to just having stuff on hand and you'll be one step closer.
You can store your stuff at my house. [LOL]
RE: Water. You can look to things that are already available to you. Getting that water from where it is to your stomach and everything in between. (like your hot water heater, toilets, rain barrel (oops don't do that it is illegal). Maybe Look in your neighborhood to see where you can get water (creek, etc) Stor the stuff you would need to render the water safe, it is easier to hide (I mean spread out the preps so it does not look like you are stockpiling stuff.) as well.
Do you have a Water BOB? It is easy to stash somewhere.
https://www.waterbob.com/Welcome.do;...09800AFC857AE2
I like how Irving mentioned the OPSEC portion. My wife is on board with me 120% but... for some reason her co-workers know a little bit too much. With me... It seems that only the preppers around me have found me out (by the way I act and the way I am observant of things around me.)
Do things gradually. What probably happened is that she watched some show like doomsday preppers and say all the idiots on that show and got turned off by all that.
Worst Case Scenario: She doesn't want to live in a world like that right? Well you gotta eat... so it is a win-win either way. I have some of my Wife's most favorite food stored in my preps. Fatten her up a little bit first.
well that went to weird.
opsec is a significant issue. I am much more clear on it than my wife. She tends to blab about things to her family, but they live cross country, so I let it go. My sons are very opsec vigilant, likely because they grew up doing it, so it just seems normal to them. Very few that know me have any idea of my prep nature. The few that do understand opsec and would never reveal it, which is why they were permitted to know, or are members of my "network". My co-workers and neighbors know me as an independent, maybe a bit eccentric, self sufficient, capable individual who just likes to learn new skills. I am fine with that. My neighbor has gotten in the habit of asking what project I am working on today, because it seems I am always doing something different. She once asked if there was anything I didn't know how to do, to which I simply responded "not yet, but I keep looking to find it".
My pop was in the military and got paid once a month when I was small. That was commissary day, when he bought a months worth that had to be carried and stored. Habits die hard. My wife grew up with just the bare minimum in the house, so it took a while to understand the benefits. In the last decade, we have seen several acquaintances lose a job and then lose everything. She tends to see the store more as a means to survive a temporary chasm rather than apocalypse. She also got into hard core couponing, which requires maintaining a store of supplies to work from. She quickly learned the long term savings of buying when the deal is available rather than waiting for the need. That extends to most everything in one way or another. Frugality and what is commonly known as prepping are typically closely aligned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delvehound
Hide your wife's phone charger, then make sure her phone is left on till it hits LOW BATTERY. Give her 30 min without a phone, she'll start to come round. OR shut off the main breaker for a few. BTW: 2 weeks ??? Even the PSA's on the college radio station suggest 30 days.
As for water, the gallon size and usual 8oz bottles by the case are easy to store and carry.
My spouse didn't care for long term food storage (based on her "vision" of storage containers) Till i picked up a case or 2 of food from the LDS Cannery. That same day she had the next order form filled out. Since then every food item is on spread sheets. Use it, cross it off, put on items to buy list. .
In terms of other "just in case items" Never been a problem with her.
<Mind Blown> Wow, I've never thought of it that way. Well put Sir!Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving
I suspect this is exactly what happened. Somewhere along the line, she saw one of those shows and thinks when I say "Hey we should grab a case of tomato soup, and veggies because it's a killer deal right now" she envisions me digging a bunker in the backyard at 3 am...(not that I haven't thought about it with the recent political climate)...Quote:
Originally Posted by rbeau30
Funny you say that, I know this is going to make me look like a lazy ass, but The AC broke down at the beginning of the summer, and I wanted to do an experiment to see how long she'd last without losing her mind, and suffocating me in my sleep. Needless to say I got the AC fixed a couple weeks ago, however I'm impressed she lasted as long as she did.Quote:
Originally Posted by Great-Kazoo
I've always wanted to go to the LDS place, sounds awesome, thanks for the advice!
GREAT post. +1.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving
There was/is an ordnance on keeping water and not letting it drain into the gutters and street drains. I don't know if it was killed off, but do remember a guy being taken to court by the city of Aurora for holding rain catch in a barrel for his garden. This was back in the early 90s.
Still illegal in most cases
I need to make another trip as well. Get a couple cases of whatnot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Delvehound
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wulf202
I don't intend on making this a rain barrel debate. However, we are composed of mostly water. I need water to survive. I cannot live without water for long at all.
If there were AIR shortages, would anyone recognize laws that prevent me from capturing air to save for my survival during AIR shortages? Just a thought.
I wouldn't put it past them... [facepalm]Quote:
Originally Posted by rbeau30
Valid point. Until then, I like to have at least a few cases of bottled water in the basement or garage because grabbing a bottle of water before hopping in the car for a 45 minute commute is really convenient. Seems innocent enough, right?
Yes, but if you filled that water bottle from the sky, you are a criminal.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
Sounds like a dumb law. Shouldn't we tell somebody about it? Like our elected officials that are supposed to have our best interests in mind? Ohh wait those elected officials voted down the water collection bill in committee.
Sounds like we should write our city council folks until they get tired of hearing about it. That's basically how they lifted the chicken ban in Aurora. Or... you know that saying, something about forgiveness vs permission...Quote:
Originally Posted by rbeau30
I used to make fun of people for buying bottled water, and still do, but now that I stand on roofs all day, having a case in the car at all times is the new normal. I drink a few a day, take the empties inside, refill them, mark the lids, and toss them back in the car. I usually toss them after a few uses and that helps the case last longer. I just bought two cases of 40, 16.9 oz bottles of water from Costco yesterday for under $4.00 EACH. Even if you bought only one or two of those a month and stacked them in the corner of your garage (or slid them under the bed), you'd soon run out of room.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
I like the out of sight out of mind mentality myself. [LOL]Quote:
Originally Posted by Delvehound
I have two 55 gal drums in the basement and also stock several cases of my preferred drinking water - Aquafina - that we get mostly when it's on sale.
Be careful stocking gallon or larger water jugs as I've had several degrade and leak, ruining the (mdf) shelving and creating a bit of a mold mess that had to be cleaned up.
I've also taken to stocking a case of bottled water in the freezer as one other poster mentioned. They get rotated whenever we head out in the RV as it's a great way to save on ice in the coolers. Pack a few bottles around the beers and what have you and then lay on some ice. With the 7-day coolers I have, it keeps a very long time even as we add hot beers to them. If we have room in the RV freezer/fridge we throw them in there too to ease the propane use while on the road.
Oops, a few bottles a day. [hammer]
They no longer carry whatnot. BUT. i heard they may start stocking dontcaresQuote:
Originally Posted by rbeau30
Yep! Before we moved, I had about 150gal in bottled water in our basement. We routinely used enough of it that I would buy about 2 cases a month. Unfortunately in CA, the state adds a $.10 PER BOTTLE tax, so it basically doubles the price of bottled water (and increases the price of beer significantly!). I'm now looking into some different methods of bulk storage, since our house came with a tankless water heater.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving
I've got about 75 gallons of 2-liter bottles, but ran out of storage space.
Technically it's not a tax, but it becomes one if you don't claim the refund. Don't give up your recyclables to the municipal recycling bins, collect the bottles and cans and turn them in yourself. I wait till I have several bags full before I make the trek down to the recycling center. You can find one near you at this page: http://www.calrecycle.ca.gov/BevCont...spx?lang=en-USQuote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
-not all barrels are created equal, some do fine with repeated freeze/thaw cycles....Quote:
Originally Posted by Delvehound
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by Wulf202
I've been able to use snow storms or ice storms and the "what if we can't get to the store" excuse. Instead of rushing to the store the day before with everyone else why don't we go today?
Camping gear is also great since most of the time you'll have something to cook on, cook with and sleep in.
Sent from my SM-T900 using Tapatalk
I've had 4 60 gallon water barrels on my back porch (exposed to the elements) for 8-10 years now. They still hold water and are in decent condition. They are covered and not exposed to the sun however, I suspect the sun would deteriorate them. I keep recycled milk jugs in the basement, which I have heard deteriorate (as a previous poster mentioned). Typically my milk jugs are used for camping (freeze them for my ice chests), so they are replaced frequently.
Cheers,
Tim
Good timing Tim, I just took this picture this morning, with this thread in mind.
Both of these water bottles were in my car. I have a case in the back and the ones on the back edge froze, and the ones in the middle did not. The frozen one in the picture was actually in the door. This water has been in my car for months and this is the FIRST time I've seen them frozen. I know in the past people asked about keeping water from freezing in the vehicle. Looks like it's not as big of a problem as one might assume; however I will say that the frozen bottle from the picture is sitting on my counter now, and is still about 60% ice as it wasn't very warm today, or in my house.
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/wR...Q=w798-h449-no
A cooler with some styrofoam to line the inside. We have soft sided coolers, with towels wrapped around the water. It gets put inside in temps like we've had this last week. Next to the door, if we go outside town that cooler gets loaded. Everyone does something a bit different, just remember to have some defrosted ones with you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving
55gal food grade barrels, in my crawl space.
Tried cheaper 5 gal jugs and cases of bottled water, but the plastic breaks down too fast.
Anyone have any input/ideas on using WaterBricks http://www.samsclub.com/sams/wb-4pk/...cid=SPOT_4UP_3 vs 55 gallon water barrels for long term water storage?