Letter from Denver District Attorney on Marijuana and Crime

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10-30-2016, 15:16
HoneyBadger

Letter from Denver District Attorney on Marijuana and Crime

I thought the general consensus was that potheads were lazy, non-violent, and just had the munchies... [Dunno]

https://static1.squarespace.com/stat...+Denver+DA.jpg
10-30-2016, 15:38
OldFogey

Alex - I will go with illegals for $1000, please!
10-30-2016, 16:27
Wulf202

So since 2013 with the implementation of safer gun laws homicides went up 14.7%

Thank you for putting this in writing
10-30-2016, 17:03
vossman

Oh snap!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wulf202

So since 2013 with the implementation of safer gun laws homicides went up 14.7%

Thank you for putting this in writing
10-30-2016, 17:08
Irving

I doubt illegals have much to do with any of that, and most of it can be tied to simple population increase.
10-30-2016, 17:53
sandman76

True numbers instead of all the percentages would make it more believable and make more sense in general.
10-30-2016, 18:45
Rumline

Right. Were these per capita increases or just raw # increases? I suspect the latter.
10-30-2016, 18:49
fitz19d

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irving

I doubt illegals have much to do with any of that, and most of it can be tied to simple population increase.

Correct, flow of illegals has been fairly steady and I thought I saw some stuff saying it was actually down.

So what's changed. From working my previous job and this current job. Both have let me see visibly the changes. We have professional young (20-35) transients infesting fort collins/frontrange/denver. A few interviewed pretty much all say MJ for reasons to be here. Tent cities in denver were there were none before. With the legalization, there is rampant illegal grows that figure they won't get noticed, or take the risks with easier distribution.
10-30-2016, 19:00
funkymonkey1111

the sooner california legalizes reefer, the sooner these dirtbag "urban travelers" head west for warmer climes

his letter says "colorado sucks because of legal weed. don't let it happen to you--we'll take all the crime we can handle"
10-30-2016, 19:08
Big E3

Confirms what appeared to me to be happening. I wish he would have also included numbers on hit and runs, I know they’re up. I’m sure there are more illegals here now, but I’m also sure there are a lot more “legal low-life’s” that have no intention of ever working when they can just take what they need.
10-30-2016, 19:12
Irving

I think studies show illegal immigration has dropped since 2009. Don't hold me to that though.
10-30-2016, 19:35
Big E3

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irving

I think studies show illegal immigration has dropped since 2009. Don't hold me to that though.

I think that’s what general contractors believe as well, given the continued labor shortages.
10-30-2016, 21:54
GilpinGuy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irving

I think studies show illegal immigration has dropped since 2009. Don't hold me to that though.

I haven't seen any studies, but I check 100's of IDs every week. The number of phony "consular cards" I see has skyrocketed in the last few years - many are so bad it's laughable. So much so that we simply do not accept any consular cards as acceptable ID any longer.

The number of Central and South American passports I see has skyrocketed as well. These aren't necessarily illegal aliens, but it says something as far as demographics.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big E3

I think that’s what general contractors believe as well, given the continued labor shortages.

I'm half serious and half sarcastic here, but why would an illegal alien go and work instead of just getting on government life support right away?
10-30-2016, 22:06
Irving

Quote:

Originally Posted by GilpinGuy

I'm half serious and half sarcastic here, but why would an illegal alien go and work instead of just getting on government life support right away?

It's very well known that most truly illegal immigrants do their best to avoid attention. Announcing yourself by signing up for government programs is the opposite of trying to stay under the radar.
10-30-2016, 22:14
GilpinGuy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irving

It's very well known that most truly illegal immigrants do their best to avoid attention. Announcing yourself by signing up for government programs is the opposite of trying to stay under the radar.

Is that why so many vote? [LOL]

Seriously though, how many stories have we seen about illegal aliens getting "in state tuition", food stamps, driver's licenses, etc.? It seems like many don't feel all that threatened these days if they're going and getting the "black stripe" Colorado ID that basically says I AM AN ILLEGAL ALIEN - NOT FOR FEDERAL ID PURPOSES.
10-30-2016, 22:18
GilpinGuy

Back to the OP.

Just say recreational MJ was legal everywhere in the US. What would happen to the overall US crime rate?
10-30-2016, 22:43
KAPA

Quote:

Originally Posted by GilpinGuy

Back to the OP.

Just say recreational MJ was legal everywhere in the US. What would happen to the overall US crime rate?

Ill play along... It would go up.

Gateway drug, leads to other drugs, crime, loss of employment, more social programs, medical problems, MORE crime and thus an overall negative impact on a productive society.
10-30-2016, 22:53
Jonsey

How much money would the pharmaceutical companies loose if MJ was legal everywhere in the US?
10-30-2016, 22:59
cstone

The smaller producers would eventually be gobbled up by larger producers and those large corporate producers/distributors would become the evil wealthy corporations who don't pay enough taxes. See history of tobacco and distilled spirits industry in the United States.

The power of government would be turned against the small producers who could not produce enough to pay the regulatory burden easily borne by large corporate producers. Law enforcement would focus on driving small producers out of business and a culture of bootleg pot would persist for many decades.

As a product ripe for "sin taxation" MJ would be regulated and taxed to whatever extent the market could bear. Who knows, eventually some state like Colorado could actually attempt to pass a 100% tax increase based on the logic that the proceeds would go to fund marijuana awareness and treatment programs. (See Amendment 72)

An interesting read on Colorado's MJ experiment: http://harvardjol.com/2015/08/05/goi...-amendment-64/
10-30-2016, 23:06
Jonsey

Quote:

Originally Posted by cstone

The smaller producers would eventually be gobbled up by larger producers and those large corporate producers/distributors would become the evil wealthy corporations who don't pay enough taxes. See history of tobacco and distilled spirits industry in the United States.

The power of government would be turned against the small producers who could not produce enough to pay the regulatory burden easily borne by large corporate producers. Law enforcement would focus on driving small producers out of business and a culture of bootleg pot would persist for many decades.

As a product ripe for "sin taxation" MJ would be regulated and taxed to whatever extent the market could bear. Who knows, eventually some state like Colorado could actually attempt to pass a 100% tax increase based on the logic that the proceeds would go to fund marijuana awareness and treatment programs. (See Amendment 72)

An interesting read on Colorado's MJ experiment: http://harvardjol.com/2015/08/05/goi...-amendment-64/

Sadly, this is good logical thinking. And they would still raise property taxes.
Also, this is why I am for a lot less regulation of everything.
I can't believe that crime would increase though as a direct result, but I am sure some may disagree with me.
10-30-2016, 23:14
Honey Badger282.8

I remember seeing a piece, I forget who it was made by, where the interviewed several folks involved with MJ in Colorado to include a long time dealer. He basically said that the legalization has had no effect on his business because the legal stuff cost several times more than his.
10-31-2016, 00:14
GilpinGuy

Quote:

Originally Posted by KAPA

Ill play along... It would go up.

Gateway drug, leads to other drugs, crime, loss of employment, more social programs, medical problems, MORE crime and thus an overall negative impact on a productive society.

This has all been debated to death. When I was an underage dope smoking hippie idiot it was much easier to score weed than beer. I imagine it's the same now.

My bottom line is that I think that anyone who wants to smoke pot now is smoking pot, regardless what the law is. I just don't see hordes of people saying "Ohh, it's legal now, so I'm gonna start smoking, robbing people and go on welfare".

If it was "legal" everywhere, we wouldn't have idiots moving here - they'd just stay where they are and we wouldn't have these problems. It would be status quo.

Since minor possession arrests would basically be zero, I guess that would have a big impact on statistics too.
10-31-2016, 00:20
GilpinGuy

OP: Was this an open letter to Kali voters? Where did you find this?

I'm not accusing you of anything nefarious, just wondering.
10-31-2016, 06:22
jmg8550

Quote:

Originally Posted by KAPA

Ill play along... It would go up.

Gateway drug, leads to other drugs, crime, loss of employment, more social programs, medical problems, MORE crime and thus an overall negative impact on a productive society.

Exactly what the Democrats want. That way, they can keep those on the Gov't welfare and get votes.

Not all who smoke pot are idiots. Some are functional potheads, just like there are functional alcoholics.
10-31-2016, 08:37
HoneyBadger

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonsey

How much money would the pharmaceutical companies loose if MJ was legal everywhere in the US?

I think this is a valid question. With such a large percentage of Americans addicted to painkillers of some sort, it seems logical that the "Big Pharma" groups would take a hard hit. I imagine they are fighting legalization with every reasonable lobbying penny.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GilpinGuy

OP: Was this an open letter to Kali voters? Where did you find this?

I'm not accusing you of anything nefarious, just wondering.

Rule #1: Question everything.

I found it on facebook, posted as a picture.

Googling it turns up this:http://calmusa.org/calmcablog/2016/1...t-legalization (Link to picture is at the end of the first paragraph)
In the news: http://www.kolotv.com/content/news/D...393361991.html
Other data: http://www.rmhidta.org/
10-31-2016, 08:43
Erni

Quote:

Originally Posted by HoneyBadger

I think this is a valid question. With such a large percentage of Americans addicted to painkillers of some sort, it seems logical that the "Big Pharma" groups would take a hard hit. I imagine they are fighting legalization with every reasonable lobbying penny.

No, they will simply set up their own grows and labs when it becomes federaly legal.
10-31-2016, 09:52
Gman

Quote:

Originally Posted by cstone

The smaller producers would eventually be gobbled up by larger producers and those large corporate producers/distributors would become the evil wealthy corporations who don't pay enough taxes. See history of tobacco and distilled spirits industry in the United States.

The power of government would be turned against the small producers who could not produce enough to pay the regulatory burden easily borne by large corporate producers.

Evil corporations don't pay taxes. Taxes and regulatory fees are passed on to consumers in the form of higher prices. Business 101.
10-31-2016, 09:54
Graves

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erni

No, they will simply set up their own grows and labs when it becomes federaly legal.

Yeah, going from producing and marketing a synthetic substance to an organic on a monumental level is pretty streamline.
*facepalm
10-31-2016, 10:42
Irving

Not all people who drink alcohol are alcoholics.
10-31-2016, 11:26
StagLefty

^I don't drink yet I'm an alcoholic ????
10-31-2016, 11:46
Mazin

Yes California please legalize pot and take back your people moving here. While your at it tell New York and other states on the east coast to follow suit.

Brought to you by the "GTFO Colorado Foundation".
10-31-2016, 12:23
MarkCO

I will never be in favor of legalization of drugs, but it is also clear that the "War on Drugs" and the way in which most large urban cities deal with it does not work either.

This solution is one that is intriguing and one I wish more people would consider, regardless of their personal view of drug use. There is obviously more than just this cover story, but when there is no benefit in crime for those on either side, I see that as reasonable policy.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-10301780.html
10-31-2016, 13:15
Gman

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkCO

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-10301780.html

Interesting note from an associated photo piece on where drugs are or aren't legal that I didn't seen mentioned in the linked article;

Quote:

In 2001, Portugal became the first country in the world to decriminalize the use of all drugs, and started treating drug users as sick people, instead of criminals. However, you can still be arrested or assigned mandatory rehab if you are caught several times in possession of drugsGetty
10-31-2016, 13:19
MarkCO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gman

Interesting note from an associated photo piece on where drugs are or aren't legal that I didn't seen mentioned in the linked article;

Portugal decriminalized drugs, not made them legal. There is a difference. They basically treat them like traffic violations and if someone has a problem, like a health issue.
10-31-2016, 14:04
asmo

There is a giant political push (eg. multiple millions of dollars) by the Democrats to get California to say NO to the Marijuana law there. It is a calculated strategy to get the left leaning folks to go to other states and influence elections there (e.g. what happened to Colorado).
10-31-2016, 15:14
Irving

Even with full legalization in the entire US, Colorado will still be cursed with being Colorado. If you can get high anywhere in the US, would you rather move to Oklahoma or Colorado?
10-31-2016, 15:20
Great-Kazoo

Quote:

Originally Posted by asmo

There is a giant political push (eg. multiple millions of dollars) by the Democrats to get California to say NO to the Marijuana law there. It is a calculated strategy to get the left leaning folks to go to other states and influence elections there (e.g. what happened to Colorado).

if that were true CA, would become a ghost town within the month. There's millions of dollars riding on the ballot in CA with anyone heavily involved dropping $$$$
10-31-2016, 15:27
osok-308

Quote:

Originally Posted by HBARleatherneck

So mj caused all of the crime? Nothing to do with the ever increasing flow of illegals?

It would be easier to read if the he could proof read it for spelling errors. Its not very professional.

It's not just illegals. It also stretches to the amount of legal people we have moving here. I can't tell you how many times I speak with people whose main reason for moving here was for the legalized weed. Correlation does not always mean CAUSATION. That being said, more people moving out here causes an increase in population. More people = more potential criminals and victims, which, = higher crime rates. I'm not stating that weed is causing increases in crime, I'm stating that increase in population leads to an increase in crime. People moving out here for the weed may cause an increase in crime. It's not the weed, it's the people that come here FOR the weed.
10-31-2016, 15:45
GilpinGuy

Quote:

It's not the weed, it's the people that come here FOR the weed.

Hmmm, almost sounds like "Guns don't kill people, people kill people."
10-31-2016, 16:07
wctriumph

Here is the deal with MMJ. As I have said before, my wife has a MMJ card as prescribed by her former doctor for management of her chronic pain. However, her doctor retired and her new pain management doctor has said that she can't treat my wife if she tests positive for MJ. They test her every month as per the regulation in the affordable care act. It is against the law to treat her if she uses MJ, even if legal in the state. She suffers because of it and the doctor can't do anything about it and because of the regulations in the law to deter the abuse of prescription drugs, the .gov monitors what she can and cannot use.

It is a fucked up situation.

On that note, I completely believe that crime has gone up significantly with the legalization of recreational MJ.

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