AR-15 Sound Suppressors/Silencers

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02-12-2018, 20:59
CoGirl303

AR-15 Sound Suppressors/Silencers

I am not sure of the correct terminology for this but I put both in the subject. I wasn't sure if they were sound suppressors or silencers, or both.

Anyhow, I have the S&W M&P Sport II with the A2 front sight and a flash suppressor (I think?) screwed into the front. As seen below
https://pull01-lc82d8jxkvzhn9n4baz6..../3/2/32463.jpg

I am considering applying for a stamp to put a suppressor/silencer on but I don't know anything about them, what to get or what to look for.

Do I need to have my barrel threaded? (if so, where would I get such a service done at?)
What suppressor/silencer should I look at?
How do I know what suppressor/silencer reduces the most sound?
What should I look for in a suppressor/silencer?

I guess my budget would be about $900-$1000 for one (not including the $200 for the stamp).

I do know it requires ATF Form 4
Wait time is 6-12 months
$200 for the stamp
That's about all I do know on this matter.

Please educate me on suppressors/silencers.

Thank you.
02-12-2018, 21:05
00tec

Your barrel is threaded under that birdcage flash hider. Unscrew it, screw on a brake or flash hider that is compatible with the suppressor.
02-12-2018, 21:07
DEAGLER

Look into the silencerco hybrid. Love mine.
02-12-2018, 21:13
Joe_K

https://youtu.be/51cSzfn-WCo

This should get you started. Since you already have a budget in mind, do you think this will be your only suppressors for the foreseeable future, or the first of many?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
02-12-2018, 21:26
Irving

https://www.ar-15.co/forums/110-NFA-Items

www.silencertalk.com
02-12-2018, 21:43
Wolfshoon

I'm a silencerco fan (omega, saker, others), but the last suppressor bought was a Dead Air. Dead Air's keymount is arguably one of the best, but i haven't launched a can downrange with either silencerco ASR or trifecta mounts yet. I'll be swapping out to all DA keymounts as funds allow for all the cans.

You need to decide if you want to direct thread (screw on) a can on every time or if you want a quick mount muzzle device. 2nd question is weather or not you will be getting a larger caliber rifle in the future that you want to suppress or only staying with .223/5.56. Be realistic in the goal here as that really drives the answer as to which can to get.

If you want to save money in the future, buy 3 cans now (a dedicated .22 can, .45 pistol can, and a .30 cal rifle can) and be done with it. The .45 will do all pistol calibers and the .30 will do most rifle calibers and the .22 stays on .22 because they get dirty as hell and need to be cleaned on a regular basis vs most rifle and pistol cans that are sealed/welded and cant be cleaned.
02-12-2018, 21:56
Ramsker

Also need to think about whether you want to do this under a trust (which you would have to form) or as an individual.
02-12-2018, 22:19
SAnd

The ATF calls them a Silencer on the Form 4 that you fill out to transfer it to you. Most other people call them suppressors because they don't silence, only suppress the sound. I generally refer to them as Silencers because that's what I paid $200 for. They are also referred to as a "Can" or "Cans".

A warning is in order to someone filling out a Form 4 or Form 1. They are strangely addictive. I don't know of anyone that has only one Stamp. So be careful when embarking on this new life. Wolfshoon touched on this in his post.

I love my Cans/Silencers/Suppressors.
02-12-2018, 22:32
Irving

Here is more reading material now that I looked it up. I'm not sure how up to date this site is now a days.

http://www.silencerresearch.com/free...er_reviews.htm
02-12-2018, 22:39
CS1983

Consider something .30 cal with an SBR rating, at least as such for 5.56. .30 cal gets you a large array of potential host systems and SBR rating let’s you stick it on any length barrel.
02-13-2018, 09:22
izzy

Ahhh crap how do I know if my can is SBR rated? I have to assume it is because I've used it on my SBRs with no issues.
02-13-2018, 09:26
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by DEAGLER

Look into the silencerco hybrid. Love mine.

I love mine too. Someone further down wrote "addictive" and I have to agree. I would like to purchase one or two more suppressors.
02-13-2018, 09:33
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoGirl303

I am not sure of the correct terminology for this but I put both in the subject. I wasn't sure if they were sound suppressors or silencers, or both.

Anyhow, I have the S&W M&P Sport II with the A2 front sight and a flash suppressor (I think?) screwed into the front. As seen below
https://pull01-lc82d8jxkvzhn9n4baz6..../3/2/32463.jpg

I am considering applying for a stamp to put a suppressor/silencer on but I don't know anything about them, what to get or what to look for.

Do I need to have my barrel threaded? (if so, where would I get such a service done at?)
What suppressor/silencer should I look at?
How do I know what suppressor/silencer reduces the most sound?
What should I look for in a suppressor/silencer?

I guess my budget would be about $900-$1000 for one (not including the $200 for the stamp).

I do know it requires ATF Form 4
Wait time is 6-12 months
$200 for the stamp
That's about all I do know on this matter.

Please educate me on suppressors/silencers.

Thank you.

I say wait time is more like 12 months and I have heard within the last few months that it really hasn't sped up much. I say buy from a reputable dealer that you know for sure will be around in 12 months. I think a couple people even on this board had purchased some NFA items and the dealer they purchased through was either going under or a one man shop and the died. Good book keeping will probably make it so you won't be screwed but it may take more work on your end. LFI in Johnstown is a suppressor dealer and I think Ironhorse Armory in Parker is one as well with multiple brands. I have purchased items from both places and very happy with both of them.

Plus the dealer will fill out your form 4 for you.

I don't know why but I submitted my form 4 for two suppressors and a form 1 (I filled that out as I was building it) form my SBR at the same time and my form 1 took 45 days longer to get approved. I work with a guy that submitted two form 1's (SBR and for an SBS) and they took about 16 months. He received them back with highlighted fields they wanted fixed. He did so and then had his approval in another month.

I chose a Hybrid for being universal and not suppressing the most sound. I can take it off one weapon system and put it on another. I have already used on two different rifles and need to try it out on a pistol yet. You can look at each can and their site will tell you what their decibel reduction rating is, probably in the neighborhood of 30 db. Another reason why a lot of people run .300 BLK because they can find ammo that produces less decibels. A hyrbrid will let your run it on something like that if you purchase it down the road. I believe Gemtech also makes a suppressor that is more "universal."

I'd say unless you're in the jungles of Southeast Asia fightin the Cong, go with something universal to save your money. They are addictive. I believe veterans also qualify for the program SilencerCO offers to get half off MSRP on suppressors (which isn't quite half because MSRP is always way more). There are only a few dealers in the state that can do that. I imagine the other companies offer something similar.

The ATF is a weird animal.
02-13-2018, 09:44
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfshoon

You need to decide if you want to direct thread (screw on) a can on every time or if you want a quick mount muzzle device. 2nd question is weather or not you will be getting a larger caliber rifle in the future that you want to suppress or only staying with .223/5.56. Be realistic in the goal here as that really drives the answer as to which can to get.

I do quick mount muzzle devices since I don't have a dedicated rifle for one can.

But that's something she can worry about in about 12 months from the time the Form 4 gets submitted, in my opinion. I personally messed around with both ideas and since I decided to use my can on multiple rifles I thought it best to get quick detach options.

Down the road I would love to purchase a CZ Scorpion and try a suppressor out on that.
02-13-2018, 10:02
CS1983

Quote:

Originally Posted by izzy

Ahhh crap how do I know if my can is SBR rated? I have to assume it is because I've used it on my SBRs with no issues.

Manufacturer's website should say for your model; if not, you could contact and ask. The failure resultant from too short a barrel might not be immediate, if the can is on a host system outside of its tolerance specs for muzzle blast/pressure/whatever the term is.

For example, my trust owns a Templar Ark30, but their original design. According to the company owner, when I asked him in an email, for .223/5.56, I should not use the can on a barrel shorter than 12.5" (this is for the original design, not the new ones). Now, I could probably get away with a shorter barrel, but the can is not designed for it and it would likely kill the can over the long run. Failure might not be immediate. Could be a few hundred rounds. Maybe thousands. I'm not going to find out and will just stick with the boundaries as expressed by the manufacturer.

Next can will be SBR rated for sure.
02-13-2018, 11:21
crays

Ark Tactical in Lakewood

and

DangerLee Industies in Elizabeth

are 2 reputable, forum member owned businesses.
02-13-2018, 12:12
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by crays

Ark Tactical in Lakewood

and

DangerLee Industies in Elizabeth

are 2 reputable, forum member owned businesses.

Good point. I didn't even think to push member owned stuff.
02-13-2018, 14:07
izzy

Quote:

Originally Posted by CavSct1983

Manufacturer's website should say for your model; if not, you could contact and ask. The failure resultant from too short a barrel might not be immediate, if the can is on a host system outside of its tolerance specs for muzzle blast/pressure/whatever the term is.

For example, my trust owns a Templar Ark30, but their original design. According to the company owner, when I asked him in an email, for .223/5.56, I should not use the can on a barrel shorter than 12.5" (this is for the original design, not the new ones). Now, I could probably get away with a shorter barrel, but the can is not designed for it and it would likely kill the can over the long run. Failure might not be immediate. Could be a few hundred rounds. Maybe thousands. I'm not going to find out and will just stick with the boundaries as expressed by the manufacturer.

Next can will be SBR rated for sure.

Oh sweet, it says my can is SBR rated. There was no info for my pistol can in terms of SBR rating but I have to assume that's meant for shorter barrels in the first place. Did learn my pistol can can actually handle subsonic 300BO which is interesting.
02-13-2018, 14:15
Great-Kazoo

As of 2/12/18 current wait time for individual is 4 months, 8+ for a trust. Based on someone i know who filed as individual's turn around time, combined with what i've been seeing on line.
02-13-2018, 14:25
kidicarus13

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoGirl303

I do know it requires ATF Form 4
Wait time is 6-12 months.

Plug and play.

http://www.nfatracker.com/nfa-transfer-time-tracking/
02-13-2018, 15:58
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Great-Kazoo

As of 2/12/18 current wait time for individual is 4 months, 8+ for a trust. Based on someone i know who filed as individual's turn around time, combined with what i've been seeing on line.

That is just asinine that the trust and individual are so much different in wait time. I keep everything on a trust for protection purposes
02-13-2018, 16:25
ray1970

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevDen2005

That is just asinine that the trust and individual are so much different in wait time. I keep everything on a trust for protection purposes

I suppose it depends how many people on the trust. If it takes four months for an individual a trust with four people will probably take about four times as long to process if you think about it.
02-13-2018, 16:59
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by ray1970

I suppose it depends how many people on the trust. If it takes four months for an individual a trust with four people will probably take about four times as long to process if you think about it.

But why does it take four months for a person?!
02-13-2018, 17:02
mattiooo

Quote:

Originally Posted by ray1970

I suppose it depends how many people on the trust. If it takes four months for an individual a trust with four people will probably take about four times as long to process if you think about it.

I wish that were the case, but there is only one person on my trust, and it still took 10 months for my suppressor and 9 months for my SBR.
02-13-2018, 17:41
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattiooo

I wish that were the case, but there is only one person on my trust, and it still took 10 months for my suppressor and 9 months for my SBR.

How long ago did you do yours? I'm assuming you built your SBR (Form 1)?
02-13-2018, 17:52
mattiooo

Form 4 Suppressor:

22-Apr-16 Purchase
23-Apr-16 Mail Date
2-May-16 ATF Debit Date
11-Jan-17 Approval Date
24-Jan-17 Stamp arrived at Ark

About 8.5 months of processing time.

Form 1 SBR - I need to double check the timeline, but it was in the same general time period.
02-13-2018, 17:56
mattiooo

Form 1 SBR I filed online Tuesday, May 3rd, 2016. Approved and received emailed stamp on Thursday, October 27th. Was only 6 months. Sorry about that.

I really like www.nfatracker.com/ for keeping an eye on how long things are taking (and storing all my dates).
02-13-2018, 18:01
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattiooo

Form 1 SBR I filed online Tuesday, May 3rd, 2016. Approved and received emailed stamp on Thursday, October 27th. Was only 6 months. Sorry about that.

I really like www.nfatracker.com/ for keeping an eye on how long things are taking (and storing all my dates).

They waste no time in cashing checks, that's for sure.

Hopefully this year a couple more suppressors for me. But we'll see how bills being paid off goes.
02-13-2018, 18:16
mattiooo

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevDen2005

They waste no time in cashing checks, that's for sure.

Hopefully this year a couple more suppressors for me. But we'll see how bills being paid off goes.

They get their money and then take their sweet time.

I was thinking about a 5.56 suppressor, but now my plan is to wait for the PSA low-end MP5 next year (a gun I've wanted since before I had guns) and then get an SBR stamp on it.
02-13-2018, 18:25
Joe_K

2 Attachment(s)

AR-15 Sound Suppressors/Silencers

Two honest to God clips of actual ATF employees processing Form 1’s and Form 4’s at the NFA section. This might be why it takes so long.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...6e8de27cbd.jpg https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...5e788aae92.jpg
Attachment 73493
Attachment 73494

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
02-13-2018, 18:25
ray1970

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevDen2005

But why does it take four months for a person?!

Government employees at their finest?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattiooo

I wish that were the case, but there is only one person on my trust, and it still took 10 months for my suppressor and 9 months for my SBR.

Well, in that case I'm not sure why it should take any longer than doing a non-trust individual. Maybe there's different departments processing the trusts and they're dealing with a larger volume?
02-13-2018, 18:34
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattiooo

They get their money and then take their sweet time.

I was thinking about a 5.56 suppressor, but now my plan is to wait for the PSA low-end MP5 next year (a gun I've wanted since before I had guns) and then get an SBR stamp on it.

Wait...there's gonna be a PSA version of the MP5? Where the heck have I been?!
02-13-2018, 18:38
mattiooo

Quote:

Originally Posted by KevDen2005

Wait...there's gonna be a PSA version of the MP5? Where the heck have I been?!

Yeah. 2019 scheduled release date. A PSA employee leaked photos of the development on social media, so they had a sample at Shot Show - or so their story goes. I like my AR's from PSA just fine. They're not Daniel Defense. But if the PSA MP5 is of the same quality, I'm satisfied.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOW3rXgjezg
02-13-2018, 18:49
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattiooo

Yeah. 2019 scheduled release date. A PSA employee leaked photos of the development on social media, so they had a sample at Shot Show - or so their story goes. I like my AR's from PSA just fine. They're not Daniel Defense. But if the PSA MP5 is of the same quality, I'm satisfied.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOW3rXgjezg

OH MY!!!

I've been eyeballing the CZ Scorpion Evo 3. I might have to wait and see what the reviews are gonna be like on "PS5." I want to make sure a suppressor could be used with it....

Which also keeps the relevance in this thread!
02-13-2018, 18:52
Irving

It should take at least as long to get food stamps as it does a tax stamp.
02-13-2018, 19:11
ray1970

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irving

It should take at least as long to get food stamps as it does a tax stamp.

There you go again making sense.
02-13-2018, 19:17
KevDen2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irving

It should take at least as long to get food stamps as it does a tax stamp.

LOL!
02-13-2018, 21:04
Great-Kazoo

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattiooo

They get their money and then take their sweet time.

I was thinking about a 5.56 suppressor, but now my plan is to wait for the PSA low-end MP5 next year (a gun I've wanted since before I had guns) and then get an SBR stamp on it.

There's going to be a ready to go lower AND.................... an 80% offering. Do one of those with a Binary trigger [panic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ray1970

Government employees at their finest?

Well, in that case I'm not sure why it should take any longer than doing a non-trust individual. Maybe there's different departments processing the trusts and they're dealing with a larger volume?

Trust has 2 or more people getting BGC's done. Throw in FP cards and it's the typical .gov fluster cuk
02-14-2018, 13:52
KevDen2005

Another reason I like Hybrid is it's rated down to 10 inches for 5.56. Some of the very large calibers only down to 16 inches or in some cases 18 inches. But I think it's a very versatile can and you can have a lot of fun with it on a lot of different weapon systems.
02-14-2018, 14:02
kidicarus13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irving

It should take at least as long to get food stamps as it does a tax stamp.

Waiting for food stamps is a terrible idea. If the point of assistance is to actually assist someone, then waiting on food stamps is harmful to the purpose of the program.

Most people bitching about stuff like this are very far removed from anything like food stamps. So it's easy to become jaded and just assume that everyone on any sort of government assistance is just some system abusing lackey, but the world is a tad more nuanced than that.

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