White House Promotes State Level "Red-Flag" Laws

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03-27-2018, 14:30
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White House Promotes State Level "Red-Flag" Laws

StableGenius™ isn't done protecting our 2A rights!

https://ctmirror.org/2018/03/26/whit...-ct-pioneered/

Quote:

The White House will be encouraging states to consider enacting a law Connecticut pioneered that allows the seizure of guns from people who might hurt themselves or others, administration officials said Monday.

[snip]

“We believe it’s really important for law enforcement and family members to have the right to petition a court to exercise an ERPO,” a senior Trump administration official said. The official also referenced situations in which someone is going through a difficult period or has demonstrated threatening behavior that is not criminal in nature and wouldn’t elicit police involvement.

The official said the White House plans to offer technical expertise and grant money to incentivize states to take on the legislation but is still looking for an appropriate funding source.

[snip]

If I am to believe this, and it's consistent with what Trump has said, WH wants to pay states to implement red-flag laws. Why is Trump pushing state-level gun control?

Unclear if subjects of an ERPO will receive notice to appear, due process, and what evidentiary standard is to be applied. When do people get their guns back and how? Also unclear how inevitable abuse of this power will be handled.

If LE is an arm of government, I'm also unclear how LE can have this power absent conviction. Would seem counter intuitive to 2A to give the gov a means to disarm people who have committed no crimes or allow LE to selectively deny rights.
03-27-2018, 15:24
Zundfolge

I predict these "red flag" laws will be used primarily as political bludgeons against non-violent, law abiding citizens ... and when they are actually used against real nutters they'll result in murders that might otherwise not have happened.

Again, more harm than good, but the left's god The State is feed more blood of innocents.
03-27-2018, 15:25
CS1983

*ring ring*
"Hello?"
"Hi Cav, Constitution Party sign up sheet here. You ready to jump off the elephant's back?"
"Yeah, pretty much..."
"Ok, thanks. Have a good one. See ya in a bit. Bye!"
"Bye!"
03-27-2018, 15:30
Skip

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zundfolge

I predict these "red flag" laws will be used primarily as political bludgeons against non-violent, law abiding citizens ... and when they are actually used against real nutters they'll result in murders that might otherwise not have happened.

Again, more harm than good, but the left's god The State is feed more blood of innocents.

I too struggle to see the legitimate use.

If Little Monsters go so far as to make notebooks full of plans to murder as many innocent people as possible, would they not just keep it all under wraps? Being crazy in itself doesn't make one subject to this "law" it's owning a firearm that does. So if no one knows about your guns...?

Then if not a secret, nutter gets a knock at the door and it's LE looking for the guns. We have a repeat of the DougCo shooting/murder.
03-28-2018, 04:59
DavieD55

Quote:

Originally Posted by CavSct1983

*ring ring*
"Hello?"
"Hi Cav, Constitution Party sign up sheet here. You ready to jump off the elephant's back?"
"Yeah, pretty much..."
"Ok, thanks. Have a good one. See ya in a bit. Bye!"
"Bye!"

No kidding.
03-28-2018, 05:11
Great-Kazoo

Quote:

Originally Posted by foxtrot

This message from our president has been brought to you by "I told you so™".

Had "red-flag" laws existed based on the mere promise of a "family member" several years ago, even I probably wouldn't be legally permitted to buy firearms at this point. Some families have sociopaths - I'm not blood related to those in mine (and luckily, at this point they have no credibility left). Yet, guess who is going to be making primary use of things like this - ah yeah, the manipulators, the sociopaths, who can now brand someone a violent threat absent due process for their own purposes. While I may not be personally affected by this point, many innocents will be.

Parents with violent shitbags? Nah, they won't be using red-flags. It's not in our genetic coding to do that to your children.

ETA: More than anyone I have to withhold my feelings on this matter. I will say nothing pisses me off than a gov't that ignores due process. I'm hoping for a Pence+new VP ticket in 2020 and I'll leave it at that.

It's the perfect way of one's ex getting custody of the kids, without ever using an attorney.
03-28-2018, 07:46
roberth

So they're promoting a violation of the 2nd Amendment at the state level without due process.

Swell.

Are they going to be taking cars away from people who consume alcohol or dope because "they might have a little too much" and could cause a potentially deadly traffic accident?

Are they going to be taking cars away from people who text and drive because those people might be distracted while driving and could cause a potentially deadly traffic accident?

The list is endless.

Then I see this in the presidents twitter:

Quote:

THE SECOND AMENDMENT WILL NEVER BE REPEALED! As much as Democrats would like to see this happen, and despite the words yesterday of former Supreme Court Justice Stevens, NO WAY. We need more Republicans in 2018 and must ALWAYS hold the Supreme Court!

Umm President Trump, which is it going to be? Support the 2nd or violate it?
03-28-2018, 08:43
Bailey Guns

Sounds like he's having a real hard time figuring out which side has the greener grass.
03-28-2018, 09:23
roberth

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bailey Guns

Sounds like he's having a real hard time figuring out which side has the greener grass.

Could be just bait too, like he did with DACA. The communists have almost completed abandoned those illegals.

I'd prefer he not use natural rights as bait though.
03-28-2018, 09:38
Skip

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bailey Guns

Sounds like he's having a real hard time figuring out which side has the greener grass.

As I've said, I think he's abandoned us for the perception of security. I think things are probably more fragile than we think.

Doesn't excuse it and I'm pissed too. He needs to be called for the false promises and I think 2020 is done.

Quote:

something, something people who trade liberty for security are fools something, something
03-28-2018, 10:21
wctriumph

The guy is pretty pragmatic about things in general. I thought that this was pretty evident from his business dealings. Most really successful business types are and being pragmatic doesn't mean being untruthful, it just means finding a way to get something done. By turning the issue over to the states he takes himself out of the equation.
03-29-2018, 19:18
CoGirl303

Quote:

Originally Posted by Great-Kazoo

It's the perfect way of one's ex getting custody of the kids, without ever using an attorney.

It could also be used by liberal roommates to remove a conservative, gun owning roommate they don't like without justification or proper eviction.

completely dangerous.

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