Reliability/Failure Modes of a BYO?

So, I've done a bunch of poking around here and other AR sites and I'm wondering what are some of the more common failures of a BYO gun?

My question arises directly from reading USMC03's AARs in where he's saying that the only real failure of weapons at the trainings he has attended were on BYO guns.

I'd like to know what these "tits up" situations are and why, if the parts used in a BYO are mil-spec, and assembled correctly, would they be more prone to failure than a factory gun?

I have the utmost respect for observations and opinions held by people with with a boat load of experience (way beyond any I'll ever have). I would really like to all but fail proof my own BYO.

The Norseman

Not so much as failures but most headaches I have seen on BYO/Home built rifles have been due to Cranial Rectalitis on the owners behalf.
Few have been issues with faulty components.
Number one offender is improper assembly/ lack of knowledge. Broken pin bosses, cross threaded pistol grip and extension tubes, cross threaded barrel nut, overtorqued and undertorqued barrel nuts, dry barrel nuts.
Poor selection of parts such as wrong buffer spring vs buffer, commercial buffer tube vs mil spec buttstocks etc are right up there with issues.
Folks trying to "hotrod" their rifles by tinkering with gas port sizes, adjustable gas sytems etc.
"Bubba" gunsmithing is a culprit as well.
"I just polished it a bit with my Dremel" is either the worst or the best phrase a Gunsmith can hear.

Some home builds are awesome and the great thing about it is you can build it the exact way you want it. But take the time to research the components you are planning on using. They need to work together as a system for the build to perform and if you have questions,call the manufacturers. Most are very willing to help.

So kind of like when people build up a naturally aspirated motor, then decide to turbocharge or supercharge it and use the same N/A parts (heads and cams)?

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Originally Posted by Stuart

So kind of like when people build up a naturally aspirated motor, then decide to turbocharge or supercharge it and use the same N/A parts (heads and cams)?

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Did I miss something, or is Stu just rambling on about his Type-Arrrrrgh days?

LOL, it's been so long since I've seen that term that I didn't know what you were talking about.

I always figured I'd purchase a factory gun, just so I could familiarize myself with the platform, and go from there. I always hear people say that if you build your own, you can get exactly what you want, but since I've never had one, I have no idea what I want.

Now, I'll bow out and back to your regularly scheduled program. :)

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Originally Posted by Stuart

LOL, it's been so long since I've seen that term that I didn't know what you were talking about.

I always figured I'd purchase a factory gun, just so I could familiarize myself with the platform, and go from there. I always hear people say that if you build your own, you can get exactly what you want, but since I've never had one, I have no idea what I want.

Now, I'll bow out and back to your regularly scheduled program. :)

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Stu, suggest you just drop a nickle in an ammo can for every post, you will have your fist AR in no time...

[Beer]

Point taken. :(

I've seen some home builds to salavate over. I've seen some home builds that were paper weights. In every instance, the success or failure came down to the intelligence level of the builder. Even the first home gun builds, the intelligent ones read, and read, and find assistance, and read... (you get the point). The retards, well, they really like to talk about "how much money they saved" for their masculine paper weight.

I know this is going to be a news flash from me after my "buy the most expensive gun you can" thread, but quality parts cost more than shitty parts. The parts that work better are more sought by shooters, therefore harder to come by, and [Eek3] (this is a shocked and awed face) cost more money.

So, in conclusion, I would have to say the reliability and accuracy of the home build is completely dependent on the builder's intelligence and their willingness to use quality parts in their build.

As to what the most common failures are; breaking the little parts that take subtlety to assemble, shooting springs and retaining pins into the next county (and losing them), jacking up gas tubes/jacking up barrel nuts, buying BCG's that the key isn't steaked (that's my favorite one), bending the shit out of the gas rings and then wondering why they blew off into the action and F'ed everything up, commercial/mil spec buffers and tubes and a complete lack of understanding there are two different sizes. Did I mention shooting springs and pins off into outerspace? [Tooth]

I tried to save some money with a "Trigger Job" rather than paying for the improved trigger to start with. I ended up purchasing both as well as dealing with unpredictable trigger as I learned the hard way.

Dropped in a Rock River NM and never looked back.

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Originally Posted by esaabye

I tried to save some money with a "Trigger Job" rather than paying for the improved trigger to start with. I ended up purchasing both as well as dealing with unpredictable trigger as I learned the hard way.

Dropped in a Rock River NM and never looked back.

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+1
About all you want to do to a stock trigger is stone polish the engagement surfaces. They are Casehardened just a few thousandths deep and you cut too deep and you are into softer material. If that happens you now have some strange shaped fishing weights.


Buy the best you can- that way you never question it and don't have to spend your money twice.

Thanks all! Though I'm not the sharpest tack in the box, I felt that I rose to the occasion in terms of a thoughtful build process.

I guess the lowest end of parts I used was a DPMS LPK and I've already replaced the trigger group with a RRA two stage.

I weld custom bicycle frames in Titanium and steel, so I "get" attention to detail and craftsmanship.

The torture test would obviously be a 1000+ round carbine course. $$$$ Maybe soon....

Norseman

Another way some people fail is with optics. They'll spend $1000+ on their weapon, then mount a $35.00 reddot and wonder why they are printing 1' instead of 1" groups.

I would much rather depend on a $350.00 rifle with a $1,000 worth of glass on it than a $1000 rifle with $350.00 worth of glass.

Another thing to look at in this equation is TOOLS. Even if you have all the best parts, you have to have the proper tools to be able to put one together. The blocks to be able to hold the receiver, the tool to keep from launching the takedown pin retainer spring across the room, barrel nut wrench(s), special punch for installing the roll pin that retains the bolt catch, the hammer block to be able to dry fire the lower, there's a lot of special tools. You don't have to have all of them, but some are absolutely essential for a proper AR build. I take great pleasure in assembling a new AR not just because I'm not paying someone else to do it for me, but because I enjoy it. The right parts, right tools, and right know-how are all essential.

+1 on the trigger work. I used RRA 2 stage match triggers until I discovered JP triggers; now it depends on what I'm going to do with the gun. A well-adjusted JP trigger on a varmint gun is a beautiful thing!

I built my own lower with some cheap punches a rubber hammer and a leatherman.... the hammer pin snaped clean in half after about 500 rounds I uesd a cmmg kit so I called them and they sent me a knew one for free and it has held strog so far (about 600ish rounds). I have no idea why it broke but I now always have a full lower parts kit in my range bag.

Years ago.. like in the 80's I had factory built AR's. I have since sold them all. I only have home builds. Most are factory assembled uppers. I have never had any type of weapon malfunction due to the weapon.

Now you might now say I don't shoot enough. I was going through my spent brass yesterday because I need to load again because I only have 5k rounds loaded. I started counting brass and stopped at 5k empty brass.(just counting 5.56/.223) This has only been since June. BTW all my ammo is reloads also. I can't remember the last time I shoot factory ammo. Thank goodness for progressive presses.

I reload a lot. I have also shot and reloaded 6k of 12ga this summer and 3k of 9mm. All had zero failures.

I believe if you are diligent you can build a rifle as reliable or more reliable than a factory build, same goes for reloading vs factory ammo.