Glad I Don't Live In Baltimore

DISCLAIMER: This is not intended as a police-bashing thread. Please stick to civil discussion. It's more a commentary on the wisdom of the BPD leadership and actually having/displaying this sticker.

Below is a real BPD Intel Bulletin warning officers to be aware that the person(s) displaying this sticker on their vehicle might be armed.

This bulletin brings up several questions in my mind:

• Why would BPD feel 2A supporters are dangerous?
  • Seems to me if you were looking to start trouble with the police, would you advertise it?
• Is this a form of profiling? If so, why is it justified when dealing with 2A supporters?
  • If a minority group decided to come up with a sticker to display on their cars to show support for the group and to identify their group members to others, and the police distributed an Intel Bulletin regarding the stickers and the group, is that different than this?
• How is it government entities have strayed so far from what their function is supposed to be?
  • Do actions like this by BPD tend to reinforce the "Us vs Them" mentality? I say, "Yes". I also say that's not what they should be doing.
• Would you display this sticker on your vehicle?
  • I wouldn't...for reasons listed below.
• Does this sticker make your vehicle a target for thieves?
  • I doubt it.
• BPD says this sticker is not justification in itself for a stop. Do you believe that some officers, upon seeing this sticker, will go out of their way to find "justification" to stop vehicles upon which this sticker is displayed?
  • I certainly think some will...probably a small minority. But some will.

As a veteran of almost 15 years "on the job", personally it wouldn't bother me in the slightest to see this sticker displayed. I also wouldn't feel any more threatened than I would on any other traffic stop. I'd be very disappointed if a department I worked for issued a similar bulletin and I'd probably have some strong words with whomever originated the bulletin. Probably why I'm no longer a cop.

It's my opinion that this is no worse than one of those "I support my local (LE) Department" stickers with the little star on it, or the "FOP" supporter stickers, or a military sticker, etc...

Having said that, I wouldn't put one on my truck. Mostly because I don't stick anything to my truck. But I also tend not to do anything to attract unwanted attention to me by anyone...LE or not. I doubt too many criminals will know what the sticker means so I don't think I'd worry about attracting thieves. Plus, I don't leave guns in my truck, as a matter of habit.

I do think the leadership of the BPD is misguided in allowing this bulletin to be distributed, especially with the wording it contains.

Thoughts?
http://i625.photobucket.com/albums/t...s/b851249e.jpg

it is very dangerous that police in baltimore consider the possibility of a lawfully armed citizen a threat, as much of a threat as an unlawfully armed criminal

I think this is a form of profiling and hope that the BPD officers just use good judgement in cases involving traffic stops and other encounters with persons choosing to have these stickers on their cars. 9 times out of 10 most cops will just respect 2a rights and leave it at that. It's not like people are driving around with stickers that say "Driver only carries $2000 in crack cocaine." I have an NRA sticker on my car, and usually have my gun on me. If I went out on a BOLO list as an armed individual (which I'm already on the Jefferson County CCW permit holder list) I would think police would just look at it as an armed citizen practicing their 2a rights. Any cop will tell you that when dealing with the public in a society like ours there is always the chance that they will encounter an armed individual. But then again they can also assume that they're dealing with an individual who is carrying illegal contraband as well... it's all situational and that's why we entrust public safety to these individuals to help keep public safety and order- they have the training to make judgement calls and use it to decide how to approach a given situation.
Just my .02... I wouldn't place this sticker on my car, but then again, I already have 3 on my back window and don't want to have any more.

Put that along with this

http://www.gayfamilysupport.com/imag...37;20flag2.gif

and this

http://images9.cpcache.com/product_z...quare-true.jpg
And totally confuse the hell out of em.

One of the problems is the splitting that most government officials and anti gun folk seem so mired in when thinking about an "armed individual".

Just like Kellermann's flawed "43-1" study didn't differentiate between legal gun owners and criminals, these folk can't get it through their thick heads that not all "armed individuals" are the same. They honestly believe that the CPA lawfully carrying a $2500 Les Baer is just as dangerous as the gang banger with the stolen Jimenez in his pants.

Of course the other problem here is that this is clearly a calculated effort by anti gun politicians to quasi-criminalize a political belief.



I gotta wonder if the street cops that received this bulletin shook their heads as much as we did (I bet they did).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mtn.man

Put that along with this

http://www.gayfamilysupport.com/imag...ow%20flag2.gif

and this

http://images9.cpcache.com/product_z...quare-true.jpg
And totally confuse the hell out of em.

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[LOL]

I don't think this is a response from street level cops, more from the administrators that feel than ANY gun in private hands is a bad thing.

ok ill bite , so having spent most of my life in b-more ill say that sticker or not , they (bpd) have bigger concerns than looking for stickers . if any of you have been there you would know what i mean .
yes its kinda dumb to publicly add to the profile list .yes i have read the police hand book (patrol operations and enforcement tactics ,by george t payton and michel amaral) and if you read between the lines there is a way to profile and somewhat of a list . (not a leo bash just fact )
although im sure if you were to mess up in b-more and had a sticker on your truck the outcome would be the same as if you had no stickers . they dont f*ck around at all but i have always been treated fairly by bpd and so will you . they have one hard job in that city .

im not sure if that makes sense (just wakin up and still need coffee, sorry)

What if everyone started putting these on their vehicle? Maybe someone stickers all the vehicles in the Walmart parking lot, one weekend. [Muaha]

I see it as another example that the "powers that be" are scared of their subjects. Any sign of discontent or threat to their power will be dealt with.

What was this bulletin based on? Fact? Fear mongering? Political agenda?

There is a reason I don't put stickers on my vehicles.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ah Pook

There is a reason I don't put stickers on my vehicles.

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Well yeah there's all that ... also stickers are ugly.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mtn.man

Put that along with this

http://www.gayfamilysupport.com/imag...ow%20flag2.gif

and this

http://images9.cpcache.com/product_z...quare-true.jpg
And totally confuse the hell out of em.

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OK...that made me snort a little! [ROFL1]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zundfolge

Well yeah there's all that ... also stickers are ugly.

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Stickers are bad mmm kay?

http://tvmedia.ign.com/tv/image/arti...6115011923.jpg

I think a law should be proposed to BAN stickers.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mtn.man

I think a law should be proposed to BAN stickers.

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Let's start a sticker campaign in support of this!

I can understand why people don't like stickers- mine are not about making a political or social statement, I have a 10th Mountain Division sticker as a sense of pride, my Afghanistan Campaign Veteran Sticker, and my NRA sticker, that's it, no more. They're not making a statement, they're just a sense of pride, I'm proud of my service. Well the NRA one is kinda saying I support 2A, but anyone who knows me on a personal level knows I believe that if you don't agree with 2A, move to Iran.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TFOGGER

Let's start a sticker campaign in support of this!

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Ooh, I like it ... its so meta.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by alxone

ok ill bite , so having spent most of my life in b-more ill say that sticker or not , they (bpd) have bigger concerns than looking for stickers . if any of you have been there you would know what i mean .
yes its kinda dumb to publicly add to the profile list .yes i have read the police hand book (patrol operations and enforcement tactics ,by george t payton and michel amaral) and if you read between the lines there is a way to profile and somewhat of a list . (not a leo bash just fact )
although im sure if you were to mess up in b-more and had a sticker on your truck the outcome would be the same as if you had no stickers . they dont f*ck around at all but i have always been treated fairly by bpd and so will you . they have one hard job in that city .

im not sure if that makes sense (just wakin up and still need coffee, sorry)

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I read the flyer twice just to see if I could find any instruction on what the officers should do or how they should react if they saw that particular sticker. It seemed to me to be more of an "officer awareness" issue, not one directing officers to go looking for vehicles with this sticker.

Regardless of how you feel about cops or the 2nd A, most officers assume they are dealing with someone who could be armed. If the officer is informed and paying attention, little clues like bumper stickers can help give them additional information about the type of person they are dealing with.

One of the problems with bumper stickers is they stay on the car long after the original owner sells the car, or the owner may not be the person driving at the time of the traffic stop. Some bumper stickers say absolutely nothing about the driver.

Baltimore is a rough town and BPD has had it's share of bad times, just like many of the big east coast cities. The Peoples Republic of Maryland has some of the worst gun laws in the country, IMO. While I will always consider B'more my home town, I appreciate the ability I have to enjoy one of my many hobbies, here in Colorado, in a way that would just be sooo much more difficult if I was in the Land of Pleasant Living. [Coffee]

I don't know about you guys, but I hardly read any of the crap that my job passes out along these lines. I'm willing to bet that most of these pamphlets are still sitting on all the lunch room tables (under the sports section of the newspaper), on the counters in the pamphlet holders, deleted out of emails without a second glance, etc.

Loosen up the tin foil guys....it's just for their situational awareness. Loons are only supposed to be what you call ducks.....

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cstone

The Peoples Republic of Maryland has some of the worst gun laws in the country, IMO. While I will always consider B'more my home town, I appreciate the ability I have to enjoy one of my many hobbies, here in Colorado, in a way that would just be sooo much more difficult if I was in the Land of Pleasant Living. [Coffee]

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couldn't agree more ,i cant stand denver but colorado is great ! anytime i start to get pissy about this state i just remember the last time i went to shootin range in md , was asked to leave for double tappin on the pistol range . just the same i dont think folks should worry about the stickers on there cars , unless they are worried about the paint getting messed up .