Update on my car wreck

June 20th I was rear ended while heading home from The Firing Line. On June 22nd, insurance totalled out my car. About 3-4 weeks later, I got a letter from them saying the insurance info I got from the other driver (which he did not want to give up. Fortunately Aurora PD showed up and mediated) was fraudulent.

And that was it. Until today. Where I got two letters from an insurance company saying they are going to do an adjustment on the claim. I got two separate letters from them, stamped the same day. A whole lot of nothing in both of them. But one of the letters says I have the ability to submit a claim.

What should I do? Starting about a month after the wreck, I started experiencing random pains in my hands and feet, which I never got around to having checked out. I don't know if I can still submit through my insurance company to have it checked out.

Consult a COMPETENT personal injury attorney.
Make no statements nor sign anything until you do. Do not even endorse a claim check.
If you don't mind Boulder I have a good attorney I can refer you to.

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Originally Posted by BPTactical

Consult a COMPETENT personal injury attorney.
Make no statements nor sign anything until you do. Do not even endorse a claim check.
If you don't mind Boulder I have a good attorney I can refer you to.

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This ++++. The advesarial relationship between you and the policy writer should be clear to you at this point. Let the lawyer do his job.
I would start looking for a Certified massage therapist that specalizes in car wrecks that has about a thousand references but thats my preference for treatment. Your lawyers recomendation for treatment should be followed.

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Originally Posted by BPTactical

Consult a COMPETENT personal injury attorney.
Make no statements nor sign anything until you do. Do not even endorse a claim check.
If you don't mind Boulder I have a good attorney I can refer you to.

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Most definitely this. You have to get someone who knows how to navigate the system which is designed to take advantage of those who cannot. Buddy of mine went through a very similar situation a couple years ago. He hired an attorney and ended up with his doctor bills paid and enough money to replace his car.

^^^^ All that was said. If I was you I would push for retraining that way you could get a degree in Horsemanship. [Coffee]

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Originally Posted by BPTactical

Consult a COMPETENT personal injury attorney.
Make no statements nor sign anything until you do. Do not even endorse a claim check.
If you don't mind Boulder I have a good attorney I can refer you to.

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You don't need an attorney to not sign a check.

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Originally Posted by xring

This ++++. The advesarial relationship between you and the policy writer should be clear to you at this point. Let the lawyer do his job.
I would start looking for a Certified massage therapist that specalizes in car wrecks that has about a thousand references but thats my preference for treatment. Your lawyers recomendation for treatment should be followed.

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Plain out fucking fraud.

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Originally Posted by Teufelhund

Most definitely this. You have to get someone who knows how to navigate the system which is designed to take advantage of those who cannot.

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Not true.

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Originally Posted by jerrymrc

^^^^ All that was said. If I was you I would push for retraining that way you could get a degree in Horsemanship. [Coffee]

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Casual reference to fraud, but you clearly are not serious.



Ridge, in Colorado, the statute of limitations for property damage is 2 years. The limitation for bodily injury is 3 years. There is no statutory limitation for first person injury. The first 2 apply to the other driver's insurance, and the last one applies to your insurance. So you can make a claim for your injuries through YOUR insurance whenever you want and you don't have to worry about running out of time.

Your car has already been totalled out and paid for by your own insurance company, so that part of your claim is done as far as you are concerned. If you are actually injured, go seek treatment! Either you are injured, or you are not, make up your mind. Right now, the insurance company is going to seriously question any injury you present to them if you haven't even treated for it.

You should contact your own insurance company and give them the name of this insurance company that has contacted you, so that they can recover the money they paid to fix your car. Ask your company if they will reimburse your deductible, or if you should pursue the other company for it.

Contact the other guy's insurance company and see what they have to say. They are contacting you because they are legally liable for any damages/injuries caused by their driver. If you are really injured, go seek treatment and at least get an idea what you are dealing with.

If you are concerned that you will have a lasting injury, and/or are afraid that you will settle for less than you should, then you can hire an attorney. Bert is correct about signing a claim check. Since your physical damages have already been paid, any check they send you will have to do with injury and will include a release built into the check, so once you cash it, you are releasing them from further financial responsibility.

If you get an attorney involved, the insurance company will end up paying more money, but it won't be going to you. It will go to the attorney, and whatever hack doctor the attorney sends you to, in order to fluff up your medical bills.

The scum that "specialize in car accidents" exist specifically to fraud money out of insurance companies. They put you on a treatment plan that is much longer than you need, in order to bill it all to the insurance company. They don't give a shit about you or your "injury" as long as they can get you to keep coming in for treatment. Chiropractors and massage therapists have their place, but ones that deal with car accidents are scam artists. The reason they stay in business is because it is easy to find people who don't mind getting a year of chiro or massages every week for free.

The most important thing to take away from this is that if you are injured, go get treatment, that is the most important thing.

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Originally Posted by xring

This ++++. The advesarial relationship between you and the policy writer should be clear to you at this point. Let the lawyer do his job.
I would start looking for a Certified massage therapist that specalizes in car wrecks that has about a thousand references but thats my preference for treatment. Your lawyers recomendation for treatment should be followed.

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Now let's talk about this. What advisarial relationship are you talking about? The driver of the vehicle lied about who his insurance company is, not the company. What exactly is the job of the lawyer? It is to get enough money out of the insurance company to get himself paid. I've already touched on what scam artists massage therapists are that specialize in car accidents. Is there a certain way to massage a sore back that was in a car accident, as opposed to falling off of a ladder? Finally, there are two kinds of people who would take treatment advice from a lawyer, people with brain injuries, and people with the intent to commit fraud.

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Originally Posted by Irving

The scum that "specialize in car accidents" exist specifically to fraud money out of insurance companies. They put you on a treatment plan that is much longer than you need, in order to bill it all to the insurance company. They don't give a shit about you or your "injury" as long as they can get you to keep coming in for treatment. Chiropractors and massage therapists have their place, but ones that deal with car accidents are scam artists. The reason they stay in business is because it is easy to find people who don't mind getting a year of chiro or massages every week for free.

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As i said it would be my preference to see a CMT. As i said one with about a thousand references. I happen to know a certified massage therapist who has helped a lot of auto accident victims.
Often her clients have had conventional medical treatment and still suffer pain. I can assure you she is not "scum" but somone who has a genuine gift for healing who has chosen this as her lifes profession. She has a BA in a related field and could have made much more $ in that. My understanding, as the law changed eight years or so ago CMTs can not directly bill insurance companys so im not sure how the CMT's can scam the insurance companys. The CMTs have to wait until settlement to get paid from the client not the insurance company the exception being doctor ordered treatment. The CMT I know is of the highest moral character. If the client she is treating shows no signs of improvment within a year she will not see that client anymore. The characterization you have written above is competely untrue in all aspects in reference to the CMT I know.

I don't have much for you other than to tell you that if you really are having problems physically to get them checked out and make sure it isn't something serious or see if it can be fixed easily.

As far as the insurance goes, as long as you got paid back for your car, be glad you got that. maybe try to get your deductible paid back and have the guys insurance pay your insurance company back since it wasn't your fault.

and if your medical problems really are a result from the accident then tell the insurance company they need to cover it, if they refuse then get yourself an attorney and make them pay for it.

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"Now let's talk about this. What advisarial relationship are you talking about? The driver of the vehicle lied about who his insurance company is, not the company. What exactly is the job of the lawyer? It is to get enough money out of the insurance company to get himself paid. I've already touched on what scam artists massage therapists are that specialize in car accidents. Is there a certain way to massage a sore back that was in a car accident, as opposed to falling off of a ladder? Finally, there are two kinds of people who would take treatment advice from a lawyer, people with brain injuries, and people with the intent to commit fraud."

Its advesarial because the insurance companies vested interest is to extract themselves from the legal obligation at the lowest cost. The injured party needs treatment. The policy writer is instituting policies designed to have the maximum amount of people give up their legal rights as defined by the policuy at the lowest cost to the policy writer. The job of the lawyer is to make sure that the injured party recieves the full benefit of the policy they have paid for. The policy holder is no more qualified to deal with the insurance company than he would be to deal with the legal system himself in any other matter.

Irving: I love reading your posts about insurance claims, you are aways spot on! And by the way I am a insurance adjuster. I can only speak for my company but we NEVER pay more if a person has an attorney, we paid for the fair amount for the damages. Whether its property damage or injurys

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Originally Posted by xring

As i said it would be my preference to see a CMT. As i said one with about a thousand references. I happen to know a certified massage therapist who has helped a lot of auto accident victims.
Often her clients have had conventional medical treatment and still suffer pain. I can assure you she is not "scum" but somone who has a genuine gift for healing who has chosen this as her lifes profession. She has a BA in a related field and could have made much more $ in that. My understanding, as the law changed eight years or so ago CMTs can not directly bill insurance companys so im not sure how the CMT's can scam the insurance companys. The CMTs have to wait until settlement to get paid from the client not the insurance company the exception being doctor ordered treatment. The CMT I know is of the highest moral character. If the client she is treating shows no signs of improvment within a year she will not see that client anymore. The characterization you have written above is competely untrue in all aspects in reference to the CMT I know.

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First, you are correct that the law changed (from PIP to Medpay) and they do not bill directly. The patient pays, then submits the receipt to insurance and is reimbursed.

Second, I love massages, and feel the same way about those who enjoy their work as you do. However, being a claims adjuster, I get to see how those scam artists operate in the same field as the good guys; just like in any industry.

I don't want to steer Ridge away from getting whatever treatment will work the best for him, be it chiro, massage, or even acupuncture, but when you direct a person toward someone who advertises that they specialize in car wreck treatment, more often than not, you are pointing them right to a scam artist. I have no doubt that your friend is of the utmost moral character, but watch the way in which you recommend people to her because it sounded like you were encouraging fraud in your first post.

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Originally Posted by xring

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Its advesarial because the insurance companies vested interest is to extract themselves from the legal obligation at the lowest cost. The injured party needs treatment. The policy writer is instituting policies designed to have the maximum amount of people give up their legal rights as defined by the policuy at the lowest cost to the policy writer. The job of the lawyer is to make sure that the injured party recieves the full benefit of the policy they have paid for. The policy holder is no more qualified to deal with the insurance company than he would be to deal with the legal system himself in any other matter.

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This is a well crafted response, and no one can deny that insurance companies make an effort to mitigate costs, however, in this case, Ridge is not dealing with his own insurance company, so he has paid for nothing. I realize that only bolsters your argument.

Insurance companies are easy to hate because people do not care to understand what their policy actually covers, people tend to think they are owed all kinds of things they don't deserve, and on the occasions when an insurance company does screw up, the court cases are highly publicized (as they should be). Insurance companies DO try to mitigate costs, just like every other company in the world. Sometimes you will see an overzealous claims manager who thinks he/she is going to be Hero of the Day by shorting someone out of some money. Similar to how an overzealous District Attorney sours people on all lawyers and the entire justice system.

Take this news story I recently posted as an example of why insurance companies are concerned with mitigating costs.
http://www.myfoxphilly.com/story/197...-trolley-crash

Here is an instance where not everyone on this trolley even realized that they were in an accident, yet 9 people lawyered up and claimed they were seriously injured. How many times do you think you could receive claims like this before you'd start to look at every injury with some amount of skepticism?

Ridge: If you don't feel comfortable dealing with the insurance company, hire an attorney, but do it for the right reasons. Also, don't threaten with an attorney, just get one. Society is so litigious that everyone thinks that they can sue for anything and everything. Even in the jobs I've had that have not been in the insurance industry, I've never taken the threat of an attorney seriously. Ridge, you should fully expect your injury to be looked at very skeptically since it hasn't bothered you enough to treat for it. However, a few months from the accident is not all that big of a deal, especially for a minor injury, and if you are hurt, then you are owed compensation. PM me with any questions you might have and I will help you as best as I can.

i'll actually agree w/ Irving on the seeking treatment part.. If you're hurt go see a damn doctor and FOLLOW WHAT THEY FUCKING SAY.. not what your attorney says.. a FUCKING DR.

That being said.. Insurance companies are there for one reason and that is to make money. They'll fuck you any way they can. I know this from personal experience in a wreck I was involved in (not at fault).

Funny thing, I was getting fucked by MY OWN insurance company, as much as the other person involved's ins co.

An attorney is something you have to decide. If you attempt to do this on your own then you can only blame yourself if things go unresolved. Adjusters have attorneys they can bounce things off of. Each adjuster (depending on the ins company) has a certain $$$ they can go to till they 'kick it up' to the next 'guy'.

If you start to think it's hinky.. get an attorney. They might take $$ from you, but they can also make sure you don't sign your life away to an insurance adjuster who is 'just trying to help you out here'. Know that the legal process is NOT a 7/11 where you walk in hot and walk out w/ a cold drink. It takes time.. you have to be better before any money gets moved around if you are actually hurt.

Irving you're no longer an adjuster. Quit sounding like one. [NoEvil]

You certainly can get dicked around by an adjuster. They will try and settle with you the first time they talk to you. If you haven't treated yet, or haven't received a test result, or have not been seeing positive results from treatment, then decline the early settlement.

Monky, aren't I?

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Originally Posted by Monky

i'll actually agree w/ Irving on the seeking treatment part.. If you're hurt go see a damn doctor and FOLLOW WHAT THEY FUCKING SAY.. not what your attorney says.. a FUCKING DR.

That being said.. Insurance companies are there for one reason and that is to make money. They'll fuck you any way they can. I know this from personal experience in a wreck I was involved in (not at fault).



Irving you're no longer an adjuster. Quit sounding like one. [NoEvil]

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The reason i suggested following the attornys advice for treatment is that the legal system aknowledges certain treatments and diagnosis as legitamate. Why do you take the attorneys advice in regards to treatment especially if you favor treatments such as massage and acupunture? Some individuals testimony in court may not be admissable on medical matters. Which ones - I dont know but the lawyer does. I really cant believe im having to explain this to people who obviously know more about this than I do. You do what the lawyer tells you to do for the same reason you do in other legal matters- to protect yourself in a area where you have no skill.

As far as insurance fraud and felons they should get what they deserve just like any other fraud and felon. Personally Ive been rear ended twice. I carefully monitored myself injury the following weeks. In both cases I did not recieve treatment. I did not get a lawyer and i felt nervous about that but my best guess was i was uninjured. In neither case did i recieve compensation for injury. Come to find out if I understand what i read here i would have been totally screwed by endorsrment of the checks for my cars repair if I had turned out to be injured.

Ridge is telling us he is injured. Ridge I hope your injuries are minor. Get treatment. Protect yourself get a lawyer.

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Originally Posted by xring

Come to find out if I understand what i read here i would have been totally screwed by endorsrment of the checks for my cars repair if I had turned out to be injured.

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Not so, checks for physical damage are different. A check written out of collision coverage (from your company), or physical damage coverage (from the other guy's company) are separate from the coverages for injury.

I see what you are saying about knowing which treatments to seek that have a high likelihood of being paid. Some of this stuff stems from that change you mentioned from about 10 years ago. Colorado switched from Personal Injury Protection (PIP), to Medical Payments (Medpay) because PIP was too lenient. With PIP, people would actually submit receipts for stuff like Remote Healing. This is where the "healer" and patient never meet in person, the healer would just concentrate their energy on healing the patient, while the healer was at home and the patient was at work or something similar. Also, PIP coverage didn't have cap on treatment. Free massages or Chiro treatments for the next ten years after the accident that caused only $700 in damage to your bumper anyone? Acupuncture might be pushing it, but generally I would say that Chiro and massage therapy are pretty safe bets for holding up well in court.

Now you have to select your coverage limit for Medpay, $5,000, $10,000, $25,000, etc and once you reach that cap, that is it. People on here old enough to remember PIP, miss it because it was better coverage for the policy holder. It was better coverage, but it was too big of a liability and too easily abused. Agents told people the switch would make rates drop, and it did, but people like having free money.

Lets face it, Insurance adjusters are thieves looking out for the company at the expense of YOU.
you need an adequately experienced thief to get what is rightfully due to you.
If thhis were not true, there would be no Lawyers.

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Originally Posted by Irving

Monky, aren't I?

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No.. I could have sworn you said 'I used to be an adjuster'.. but any proof would have been lost in the great crash..

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Originally Posted by Byte Stryke

Lets face it, Insurance adjusters are thieves looking out for the company at the expense of YOU.
you need an adequately experienced thief to get what is rightfully due to you.
If this were not true, there would be no Lawyers.

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What's funny is when people instantly hear we'll give you $$$ to replace your car, oh and you're not hurt, that's great.. here's a check where can I meet you.. Oh.. and sign these.. they're standard..

You most certainly can get out of signing documents from an insurance company but it is NOT an easy thing to do. Most attorneys won't even go near that.

Byte you're absolutely correct that we live in a litigious society.. it's retarded what people sue for. There are times, where it helps. But let's face it, if people weren't fucking greedy the world would be a lot better. You figure out how to take that out of human nature and you'll win a Nobel something.. just like Oblunder did! [Tooth]

Wait... clarification here- people keep talking about "the other guy's insurance." I thought I read that he gave fraudulent information, I read that as he doesn't have any and he just faked the funk so he appeared to be legal. If he doesn't have insurance you are screwed as far as that goes- Hire an attorney and go after this guy for damages. It's illegal in the state of Colorado to drive w/o insurance, so this guy can be cited for that. Do you have Uninsured Motorist coverage? That's what would cover you. Unless I'm reading this all wrong and "fraudulent" doesn't equal "non-existent" in this case.

He gave incorrect insurance company info. Sounds like Ridge received a letter from this guy's real insurance company once they found out about the accident.

Funny, lots of talk about how insurance companies only want to make money and will screw you for it...

But lawyers, those guys only want to help people.

HA! [ROFL1]

I was in a accident about a year ago. Fault was put on me even though someone else ran a solid red light in front of me and the other 45mph traffic.

My insurance (Geico) totaled my car, paid off my loan and mailed me a check for the extra, paid for the repairs for the car I hit, paid for my passengers medical bills and paid for the other driver's medical bills. Everything was paid without a question. And my rates have stayed the same.

Damn, they screwed me, huh?

I have no doubt insurance companies want to make a profit. What other reason are they in business? But guess what, lawyers are in business to make a profit too.

Ridge, I hope you get fixed up and feeling better soon.

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Originally Posted by Irving

He gave incorrect insurance company info. Sounds like Ridge received a letter from this guy's real insurance company once they found out about the accident.

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Ah, thanks for clearing that up... I was confused there. [Beer]

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Originally Posted by Byte Stryke

Lets face it, Insurance adjusters are thieves looking out for the company at the expense of YOU.
you need an adequately experienced thief to get what is rightfully due to you.
If thhis were not true, there would be no Lawyers.

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This is such bullshit, maybe some adjuster may be thieves but not all of us.

I gave my insurance company a call this morning regarding this, and it looks like this guy's insurance company just made contact with them as well, as the claim was updated today.

And my adjuster said he can open a medical claim as soon as I schedule an appointment with a doctor.

As stated earlier, get an attorney, but remember while the insurance companies are paying, the suit/claim is against the driver. Most insurance companies won't settle a case without releasing the driver, but if you are beyond policy limits, a judgment against him may make his life hell some day.

That is what uninsured coverage is for. I have a friend that also put UM on his umbrella and it paid off.

I can only speak for myself but I sincerely hope that those here who are employed in the insurance industry realize that just because I perceive the consumer relationship to insurance industry to be advesarial it is not a reflection on the character of those employed in the industry. The polarization I see occuring in our society is worrying to me. My belief is in issues other than the constitution, it is every individuals responsibility to evaluate every issue seperately ethically and logically to determine appropriate course of action, not simply parroting opinions presented to us by the media or our peers. It is only from this base that one can move with a sense of purpouse as difficult as that is . When topics that are brought up that are close to home the ability to engage in a unemotional analysis are often affected. Irving you have often demonstrated that you are open minded to discourse and I value that. Besides that you guys have guns and probably know how to use them.[Tooth][Help]

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Originally Posted by CO Hugh

As stated earlier, get an attorney, but remember while the insurance companies are paying, the suit/claim is against the driver. Most insurance companies won't settle a case without releasing the driver, but if you are beyond policy limits, a judgment against him may make his life hell some day.

That is what uninsured coverage is for. I have a friend that also put UM on his umbrella and it paid off.

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I buy the largest coverage they will sell me including the $25k medical that you have to write in to get that was mandatory before the law changed, and yes uninsured motorist. I wish i could buy $250k medical on the auto insurance.

2 Lessons from what have been posted..

1. Find a good trusted insurance company
2. Find a good trusted lawyer

Both are oxymoron, but if you are self employed and small business owner, you have two of these on your speed dial.

I've been very happy with my insurance company. Progressive.

I called them the day of the crash, and they had me in their service center the next day and cut me a check for twice what I would have been able to sell the car for prior to the accident.

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Originally Posted by Ridge

I've been very happy with my insurance company. Progressive.

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So your happy supporting George Soros?

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Originally Posted by BPTactical

So your happy supporting George Soros?

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Yeah. He and I hang out on Thursdays and drink light import beer. He always bets on the Saints, though...

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Originally Posted by Ridge

Yeah. He and I hang out on Thursdays and drink light import beer. He always bets on the Saints, though...

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^ bulls.. they hang out to exchange pony stickers.

How is this going?

Are you feeling any better physically? I hope you're 100% soon Ridge.

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Originally Posted by Ridge

I gave my insurance company a call this morning regarding this, and it looks like this guy's insurance company just made contact with them as well, as the claim was updated today.

And my adjuster said he can open a medical claim as soon as I schedule an appointment with a doctor.

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Not matter what the outcome. WITHOUT any Medical Records to support you have an issue, you're SOL.
You should have seen one already, same day of incident would have been better.

Thanks for the concern, guys. My schedule has been packed and I haven't had a chance to schedule with a doctor. Hopefully I can get an appointment next week.