Suppressor order time question

Ok, this may be more applicable to the local dealer question but has anyone ordered a suppressor from Machine Gun Tours?

I stopped by about 10 days ago looking for my first suppressor. I spoke with a knowledgeable guy there and ended up leaving when we confirmed that they didn’t have what I was looking for. After arriving home I got a call back that they had an order coming in and one wasn’t spoken for. I gave my info over the phone and thought we were good to go. A couple days later I called back to check on a timeframe for the order and I was told that they can’t confirm a timeframe or even when/if the suppressor will ship from the manufacturer. I understand they can’t control the manufactures but when someone tells me that they have an order coming in I expect that they actually have an order coming in not just placed with no defined timeline.

Am I being overly critical here; I know I’ve got a long wait coming but I’d like to get that part started.

***EDIT on 12/31/12***
I wanted to update my post and let everyone know that MGT is good to go. It was just me being overly paranoid and critical and this being my first NFA purchase I didn't understand how the process works. Thanks to members like Jim for giving me some great advice.... On the NFA process not my font size. I never did figure out what he was talking about as far as the font goes. [Beer]

Every can I have bought I have been able to touch before I paid for it.

The Form 3 (dealer to dealer) wait times are just as iffy as form 4 wait times.

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Originally Posted by Hoser

Every can I have bought I have been able to touch before I paid for it.

The Form 3 (dealer to dealer) wait times are just as iffy as form 4 wait times.

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Yeah its best to find what you want in stock, because if it has to be ordered it could be a year or more before you take it home. Alan and the rest of the guys at MG Tours are great people.

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Originally Posted by CareyH

Yeah its best to find what you want in stock, because if it has to be ordered it could be a year or more before you take it home. Alan and the rest of the guys at MG Tours are great people.

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OK, now you have me scared "a year or more" when they already have my $1400????

Had they told me that they were planning on placing an order it would have been one thing but when they tell me they have an order on the way it means something completely different to me. I guess it’s time to call them back tomorrow.

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

OK, now you have me scared "a year or more" when they already have my $1400????

Had they told me that they were planning on placing an order it would have been one thing but when they tell me they have an order on the way it means something completely different to me. I guess it’s time to call them back tomorrow.

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I should add that a year makes me think it could take 6 months for them to get it in. :)

One more quick question. I understand they can’t tell me when they’ll receive it if the Form 3 isn’t finished but should they be willing to tell me if the paperwork has been submitted?

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

One more quick question. I understand they can’t tell me when they’ll receive it if the Form 3 isn’t finished but should they be willing to tell me if the paperwork has been submitted?

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Fix your damn FONT SIZE some of wear glasses
Here.
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Did you ask them? IIRC The vendor submits the paperwork to transfer to dealer. My factory SBR lower took 4 months from the time it was ordered till it was on paper @ MGT. Granted turn around time from ATF was 60 days back then.

My understanding is that if the item is ready to ship to the CLASS 3 dealer. The FORM 3 wait is no longer than a month wait (or maybe less now). Dealership transfers aren't as long as personal purchases.
I can't verify any of this... I just read a lot of this on other forums.[Pepsi]

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Originally Posted by jim

Did you ask them? IIRC The vendor submits the paperwork to transfer to dealer. My factory SBR lower took 4 months from the time it was ordered till it was on paper @ MGT. Granted turn around time from ATF was 60 days back then.

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I did not ask them about the status of the Form 3. Like I said, when I was told they had an order coming in I assumed (I know what they say about assuming) it was in the mail. I'm planning on calling again tomorrow to clarify things.


Not sure what to do about the font size. I pulled up this thread on 3 different PCs a Mac and an IPad using 4 different browsers and it looks fine on all of them.

http://www.deluzional.com/photos/i-K...-KXZKpTF-M.jpg

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Originally Posted by islandermyk

My understanding is that if the item is ready to ship to the CLASS 3 dealer. The FORM 3 wait is no longer than a month wait (or maybe less now). Dealership transfers aren't as long as personal purchases.
I can't verify any of this... I just read a lot of this on other forums.[Pepsi]

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My AOW transfer took 40ish days tops, prior to dealer - dealer transfer. One other thing is whether the mfg actually has the item on the shelf, or has to tool up for another run. ANY dealer here in CO may not be told that from the mfg, just that the paperwork is holding them up.

Careful of the "We have one on order" statement. Typically it means the following:

• You have to wait for it to get built by the manufacturer (even the "large shops" aren't very large, so this could take awhile).
• You have to wait for the Form 1 to be processed
• You have to wait for the Form 3 to be processed
• You have to wait for it to be shipped to the dealer
• You have to wait for the Form 4 to be processed

Yhea, it could take a year. The only way this becomes worthwhile is when a dealer is making a large order and is offering a deep discount in which case the wait may be worth it. That's what I'm doing with my Mystic, I'm currently waiting on the SECOND Form 3 to clear (now at about the two month mark :() since the deal was from an out of state dealer.


You have to be patient when dealing with NFA stuff. And take solace in the fact that all this paperwork is keeping NFA items out of the wrong hands. Oh, wait, that's bull. Ok, nothing to take solace in, this is harassment of law-abiding people only.


O2

Thanks for the reply. I think the way it was put was "we have 3 on the way and one isn't spoken for yet".

I just called but I have to wait for Allen (sp?) to get more details. I'll call back tomorrow. Hopefully we're in the middle of the Form 3 process. If they haven't even been manufactured yet I think I'm going to have to go somewhere else since the site that has them instock is about 10% cheaper and free shipping.

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

Thanks for the reply. I think the way it was put was "we have 3 on the way and one isn't spoken for yet".

I just called but I have to wait for Allen (sp?) to get more details.

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Ask him to define "on the way". Best case is that the form 3 proccess is done and it's in the process of being shipped (which would be my definition of "on the way" but rarely is this the case with dealers). Are they waiting on the Form 3 to clear? This would be the next best thing. But if the Form 3 hasn't yet been submitted, yhea, you got some options to weigh.

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

If they haven't even been manufactured yet I think I'm going to have to go somewhere else since the site that has them instock is about 10% cheaper and free shipping.

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So keep in mind that if you order from someone else, you'll have to pay yor local SOT's transfer fee ($100?). If you're saving 10% off of a $750 silencer and the transfer fee is $100, you're under water. On the flip, depending on how they do taxes, ordering from an out-of-state dealer may save you sales tax when MGT will charge you tax.

O2

Ps. Gotta get by MTG sometime when I'm up in Denver!

MGT Group Buy[Beer]

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Originally Posted by O2HeN2

[*]You have to wait for the Form 1 to be processed

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Manufacturers use Form 2, which is a fax-in item, and takes only a day, so that's a non-issue for a SOT manufacturer.

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Originally Posted by Circuits

Manufacturers use Form 2, which is a fax-in item, and takes only a day, so that's a non-issue for a SOT manufacturer.

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Thanks, I've been doing to many form 1s lately! :)

O2

Form 2's and form 3"s (dealer) are taking about 2 months right now. Form 1's and 4's (individual) are taking about 6mo months right now. Give or take. If the can you bought was in stock at the manufacturer or wholesaler it would form 3 to your SOT. Then you fill out the papers, form 4. 8 months total give or take. NOW if the dealer ordered direct from the factory and they were not in stock then who knows how long it will take. You add the manufacture time to the form 3 and 4 times. Rest assured no matter how long it takes the gov't will cash you check within days of getting it.

Order it online from someone who has it in stock. I have a guy that does the transfers and he is great. PM if you are interested.

Our distributor just sent in a form 3 on a Gemtech Outback 2. I'll post how long it takes when it gets approved.

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Originally Posted by raz-n-co

Order it online from someone who has it in stock. I have a guy that does the transfers and he is great. PM if you are interested.

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Putting it out there helps both the FFl & us.

Lots of good info on here.

Update:

I was informed by MGT that on the way means that the Form 3 may be in process (wouldn't confirm 100%) so should be 2 months max before they have it. I'll update everyone in December. I still feel I was somewhat misled but I'm willing to take some responsibility here.

As I've learned more I'm also a bit surprised they would take a CC over the phone for an NFA item.... I guess I have more to learn. At least that's convenient and gives me recourse if I have to dispute the charges.... not sure how that would work but it should lead to some interesting discussions should it come to that.

As I said, I'm willing to split the responsibility at the moment but for MSRP on a $1400 suppressor I would have done things differently if I had been more knowledgeable. I did check with the online store and they are in stock so with the transfer fee to Jay it would have been about $150 cheaper and I'd know the Form 3 was in process.

On a side note I'm a little disappointed that Alan was too busy to talk with me, even though he was there. I was told a couple times over the day that he was working with "Customers". I guess the guy who already paid them $1400 doesn't count as a Customer??? Not the way I do business but I guess that's his decision. I'm also looking for an M16, Uzi and MAC and at the moment I don't think I'd use them if they had one without seeing the Form 3 in person and even then it would have to be a very good price.

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

Lots of good info on here.

Update:

I was informed by MGT that on the way means that the Form 3 may be in process (wouldn't confirm 100%) so should be 2 months max before they have it. I'll update everyone in December. I still feel I was somewhat misled but I'm willing to take some responsibility here.

As I've learned more I'm also a bit surprised they would take a CC over the phone for an NFA item.... I guess I have more to learn. At least that's convenient and gives me recourse if I have to dispute the charges.... not sure how that would work but it should lead to some interesting discussions should it come to that.

As I said, I'm willing to split the responsibility at the moment but for MSRP on a $1400 suppressor I would have done things differently if I had been more knowledgeable. I did check with the online store and they are in stock so with the transfer fee to Jay it would have been about $150 cheaper and I'd know the Form 3 was in process.

On a side note I'm a little disappointed that Alan was too busy to talk with me, even though he was there. I was told a couple times over the day that he was working with "Customers". I guess the guy who already paid them $1400 doesn't count as a Customer??? Not the way I do business but I guess that's his decision. I'm also looking for an M16, Uzi and MAC and at the moment I don't think I'd use them if they had one without seeing the Form 3 in person and even then it would have to be a very good price.

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Why not outside of it being firearm related you're still making a purchase.
As for Alan, e-mail him and let him know your issues. He takes a few to get back but he does respond.

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Originally Posted by jim

Why not outside of it being firearm related you're still making a purchase.
As for Alan, e-mail him and let him know your issues. He takes a few to get back but he does respond.

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For the CC part I guess I'm still a bit hung up on all the advice around using a separate account for NFA items. I've since used our personal checking account which I guess is no different so it's probably just me being paranoid. I just don't think I've seen many places taking CC for NFA items but that could just be the fees; like I said it gives me a lot more recourse if come Dec they tell me March.

The other part that seems strange about it is that every time I've ordered a firearm online and paid by CC (probably 5 or 6) I always get a receipt mailed directly to me for the transaction. When I asked about it on my subsequent call I was told they may be able to print one up but they have my name which is all I need.

I had called the day before but was told that Alan was tied up and I should call back the next day. The next day I called not long after they opened, then around 2pm. Finally before closing I got a call back from the person I spoke with relaying to me what Alan told him to tell me. As for Alan I could hear the person I spoke with telling him I was on the phone and I could hear him tell them that he'd call me back later.

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

I just don't think I've seen many places taking CC for NFA items

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Every single NFA item I own was purchased that way and I received one airline frequent flier mile for every dollar spent [Beer]

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Originally Posted by hatidua

Every single NFA item I own was purchased that way and I received one airline frequent flier mile for every dollar spent [Beer]

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Good to know, did you get a receipt for any of them? I'd hate to see the CC fees on an M60. :)

I agree on the CC perks, I many use it to keep hotel status but basically the same reason.

I should add that Mike at MGT has been extremely helpful (at least as helpful as it seems like he has been allowed to be). If everything works out in Dec I'll be satisfied. I'm not upset just a bit annoyed at the moment.... annoyed enough that I passed on the Uzi posted here since it is on consignment at MGT.

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

Good to know, did you get a receipt for any of them?

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A receipt for each and every one of them - this isn't some shady back alley industry, there's paperwork every step of the way and yes, receipts are given just like any other vendor would give a receipt for merchandise purchased [Bang]

Exactly why the "we may be able to get you a receipt" hasn't helped my opinion..... at least I'm on a 'list'.

Posting this here as well as my Bellco thread in case someone is reading one and not the other.

In the other thread 'ssgenuine' posted that I need to make sure the receipt is made out in the name of the trust.

When I paid for the TB from MGT they just had me use a personal CC over the phone so I know it's not in the name of the trust since they didn't ask for the name. I did tell them I had just set up a trust for the suppressor purchase.

Since they don't have it in stock is this something that can be taken care of when we do the paperwork or should things have been done differently up front?

It doesn't matter how you pay for it. When you go in to complete the paper work, just take a copy of your trust with you. You'll mail the ATF forms and the copy of your trust in with it. If I recall, your trust in CO isn't valid until it's notarized.

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Originally Posted by ColoWyo

It doesn't matter how you pay for it. When you go in to complete the paper work, just take a copy of your trust with you. You'll mail the ATF forms and the copy of your trust in with it. If I recall, your trust in CO isn't valid until it's notarized.

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This. my spouse had paid for a suppressor for me. She's not on anything, just the cash machine.
Personally i believe you are stressing out over nothing and over thinking the small shit. regarding a receipt, i paid for something the other day and forgot to ask for a receipt. To obtain a copy once the transaction was done (electronically) as everything is today was not an easy task.
Should Alan get back with you, yes. However he has employees that are hired, like any other business for doing the job. Have you e-mailed Alan yet?

I have not emailed him yet, I figured calling him 4 times with no return call from him was enough. I have a team that works for me as well but when a customer wants to speak with me directly I call them back. At the moment I'm going to wait until early Dec and then email him if I haven't heard anything; if they're waiting on the form 3 it doesn't sound like there's much he can tell me now.

My first concern with the receipt was being told in Dec that they have no record that I purchased anything from them (seems unlikely but I've seen other companies do worse to people). It wasn't until member ssgenuine mentioned that the receipt should also be in the name of the trust that I got worried about the legal side of purchasing the suppressor.

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Originally Posted by ColoWyo

If I recall, your trust in CO isn't valid until it's notarized.

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Notarized AND funded. Something, anything has to appear on the Schedule A to make it a legal trust. Mine was funded with a $1 bill (recorded the serial number and put the bill in my safe deposit box).

I have seen reports of the ATF kicking back trusts that aren't funded.

O2

My trust atty was the one who told me that the reciept must be in the trust's name. I would think that Alan can write a reciept in your trusts name without a prob. Doesn't matter how you pay for it, just the sale must be to the trust. I am not sure who you would ever show the reciept to, I think it might just be if there is a issue later on, but I am guessing on that. The info on the form 4 is what really matters.

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Originally Posted by ColoWyo

Our distributor just sent in a form 3 on a Gemtech Outback 2. I'll post how long it takes when it gets approved.

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Just an FYI. Unless the distributor took some time mailing it, this form 3 took 6 weeks.

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Originally Posted by th3w01f

I was informed by MGT that on the way means that the Form 3 may be in process (wouldn't confirm 100%) so should be 2 months max before they have it. I'll update everyone in December.

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So I was trying to find an old post of mine and stumbled upon this; if the form 3 cleared in December, you should have your stamp in hand by now. Do you?

O2

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Originally Posted by jim

My AOW transfer took 40ish days tops, prior to dealer - dealer transfer. One other thing is whether the mfg actually has the item on the shelf, or has to tool up for another run. ANY dealer here in CO may not be told that from the mfg, just that the paperwork is holding them up.

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I ordered mine through Silencer Shop and they were great to work with. Originally I put myself on the list or a 5.56 can and then a couple months later they sent me a message that they came in and were holding one for me. I released that for the next person in line and decided to go with a .30 cal can so I could use it on my 6.8, 5.56 and the 300 Blk that I am building. I waited till the new models came in and then I bought mine on line. Free shipping, great discounted prices and no fee for the form 3. Took almost 7 weeks for ATF approval to allow them to transfer to the FIRING LINE in Aurora. Went and checked it out yesterday and they also were great in filling out the Form 4 for me. I brought in my Trust paperwork so it can be a pretty easy process ordering from a reputable place.