Colorado ballot proposal aimed at undoing ammunition magazine limits

From Denver Post: http://www.denverpost.com/rss/ci_22776136

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Two Littleton men have filed a proposed ballot measure that seeks to undo proposed legislation that would limit ammunition magazines of more than 15 rounds. The measure was filed Tuesday, one day after the Democratic-controlled Senate passed a bill limiting magazine rounds. Tim LeVier and J.T. Davis want voters to decide the issue in the 2014 election. Neither could be reached for comment. House Bill 1224 is a part of a far-reaching package of Democratic gun control legislation that Republicans and Second Amendment activists have denounced as unworkable and unconstitutional. The proposed ballot measure would amend the state' constitution so that only Colorado voters can decide whether to limit or restrict ammunition storage and devices. The proposal was submitted to the nonpartisan Legislative Council, the first in a number of steps in getting an issue on the ballot.

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Props to Tim and J.T. Let's make sure this passes.

Now we just need to find out how to sign the ballot initiative.

Gotta get that vote out. If you know someone who didn't vote in the last election. Talk to them. Walk them through becoming a permanent absentee ballot so they won't have an excuse. They can vote right from the comfort of their own home. Follow up with them and make sure they fill that ballot out!

This is IMPERATIVE! We can't have 50% of the Republicans sitting on their rear again next election. They've got to vote!!!

Nah, we will be fine, the Pot vote won't come back out.

Props to the initiators. Do we know who they are? How do I get signed up to carry a petition around for as long as it takes.

Good for these guy for not just bitching and actually making something happen. If someone can contact them lets get them on the boards and rally some support.

So the real question is WHO are these people and what does the initiative actually say?

I'm curious...and will be watching eagerly for further info.

Given the results of the 2012 election, do we really want this put to a popular vote?

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Originally Posted by Rucker61

Given the results of the 2012 election, do we really want this put to a popular vote?

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If people aren't too lazy to vote... YES! Otherwise, if people stay home again instead of voting... NO!

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Originally Posted by MarkCO

Nah, we will be fine, the Pot vote won't come back out.

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Actually you'd be surprised how many pro pot people are pro gun.

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Originally Posted by Zundfolge

Actually you'd be surprised how many pro pot people are pro gun.

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Not really. Seems everytime I see drug users and pushers arrested, they have firearms more often than not.

Colorado is probably the only state I've been in where the pro-cannabis people tend to be more pro-gun than in places as idiotic as California. It's too bad the people in state government right now probably smoked Bloomberg's stash so they're doing what he says.

This is freaking awesome.

Also, I bet this is the Tim LeVier named in the article.

https://twitter.com/tlevier

https://www.facebook.com/timlevier

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Originally Posted by Zundfolge

Actually you'd be surprised how many pro pot people are pro gun.

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I have intimate knowledge of this group.

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Originally Posted by Rucker61

Given the results of the 2012 election, do we really want this put to a popular vote?

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No, I was thinking there could be some risk to this, too. A year ago I wouldn't have, but now it seems all bets are off.

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Originally Posted by Zundfolge

Actually you'd be surprised how many pro pot people are pro gun.

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Or just pro liberty.

I was under the impression that because of the "immediate safety blah blah" clause, there could be no ballot proposal on this? I guess this is different because it's a constitutional amendment... hmmmm.. Slim chance but at least it's something.

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Originally Posted by Zundfolge

Actually you&#39;d be surprised how many pro pot people are pro gun.

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Or how many pro-gun are ok with a reasonable mag limit. I think we need to talk to everyone no matter what you think their position is.</p>

I'm glad to see everyone is already talking about this. I think most POT shop owners/growers would be pro-gun since they need to protect their business; that's if they are not already a con coming over from CA and unable to carry.

Lets get on this. I want a petition. Lets get this signed and on the ballot.

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Originally Posted by Jrk2262

I'm glad to see everyone is already talking about this. I think most POT shop owners/growers would be pro-gun since they need to protect their business; that's if they are not already a con coming over from CA and unable to carry.

Lets get on this. I want a petition. Lets get this signed and on the ballot.

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Not to mention they cannot legally use a Federal bank. Their businesses are essentially ALL CASH.

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Originally Posted by Rucker61

Given the results of the 2012 election, do we really want this put to a popular vote?

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Absolutely, It is a midterm election which always favors the minority party and the gun owners of Colorado will be out in force. This issue will do the same for us that Civil Unions did for the Dems in the last election. If it doesn't pass, then we have our answer that it is time to move out of Colorado.

props to the two dudes. They should get free membership here at Ar-15.co!
Hope it works out as planned.

Repeal background checks too, bogus, no more trading with neighbors etc. I Guarantee there is no facts proving these guns, from this site, show up in crimes.

Two Littleton men have filed a proposed ballot measure that seeks to undo proposed legislation that would limit ammunition magazines of more than 15 rounds.
The measure was filed Tuesday, one day after the Democratic-controlled Senate passed a bill limiting magazine rounds.
Tim LeVier and J.T. Davis want voters to decide the issue in the 2014 election. Neither could be reached for comment.
House Bill 1224 is a part of a far-reaching package of Democratic gun control legislation that Republicans and Second Amendment activists have denounced as unworkable and unconstitutional.
The proposed ballot measure would amend the state' constitution so that only Colorado voters can decide whether to limit or restrict ammunition storage and devices.
The proposal was submitted to the nonpartisan Legislative Council, the first in a number of steps in getting an issue on the ballot.
House Bill 1224 — which is sponsored by Rep. Rhonda Fields, D-Aurora — is going back to the House, so lawmakers there can consider amendments to the bill made in the Senate.
It originally passed through the House in February and Gov. John Hickenlooper has indicated he will sign the bill into law if it arrives at his desk.
If HB 1224 becomes law, anyone who currently possesses a magazine that holds more than 15 rounds is able to keep it, though if they transfer or sell the magazine, that individual would face a class 2 misdemeanor charge.
"People can do a ballot measure" Fields said. "That's something they have a right to do."
On Monday, a pair of Republican Senators said they would not abide by law.
"I will willfully and purposefully and civilly disobey this law," said Sen. Greg Brophy, R-Wray.
Lynn Bartels: 303-954-5327, lbartels@denverpost.com or twitter.com/lynn_bartels

Here's the wording of the proposed ballot initiative.

http://putittothepeople.blogspot.com/

Note that this would amend the law making it a requirement that magazine limits would have to be put to a vote, rather than being left up to the legislature. It's not a perfect solution, but it's a much more reasonable concept than 1224.

Good to see a lot being done

I do hope other avenues are being explored though... Constitutional amendments are rough. I know all eyes are on New York right now but I hope we get some similar motion here in Colorado, in re: court challenges, etc.

So, you want to defeat an unconstitutional law by inserting an unconstitutional clause into the State's constitution?
Brilliant!

News flash: Your vote no longer matters (see Obama 2012) - The final count has already been decided.
Your time and energy are better spent preparing for troubling times ahead.

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Originally Posted by davsel

So, you want to defeat an unconstitutional law by inserting an unconstitutional clause into the State&#39;s constitution? Brilliant! News flash: Your vote no longer matters (see Obama 2012) - The final count has already been decided. Your time and energy are better spent preparing for troubling times ahead.

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Can you elaborate on why you think that would be &quot;an unconstitutional clause&quot;? One would think that amending the constitution makes whatever it says constitutional. For example, you can amend the constitution to nullify any other clause, so one would think that any new clause supercedes any prior clause, and thus cannot be unconstitutional, by definition.

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Originally Posted by Rifleman

Can you elaborate on why you think that would be &quot;an unconstitutional clause&quot;? One would think that amending the constitution makes whatever it says constitutional. For example, you can amend the constitution to nullify any other clause, so one would think that any new clause supercedes any prior clause, and thus cannot be unconstitutional, by definition.

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Referring to US Constitution. Magazine limits = unconstitutional; whether they are voted on by the legislature or the population of a state.

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Originally Posted by davsel

Referring to US Constitution. Magazine limits = unconstitutional; whether they are voted on by the legislature or the population of a state.

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You&#39;re missing my point. You stated:
inserting an unconstitutional clause into the State&#39;s constitution
and thus I&#39;m asking is how can a clause (amendment) of the constitution be unconstitutional?

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Originally Posted by Rifleman

You&#39;re missing my point. You stated:
inserting an unconstitutional clause into the State&#39;s constitution
and thus I&#39;m asking is how can a clause (amendment) of the constitution be unconstitutional?

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Nevermind

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Originally Posted by sniper7

Good to see a lot being done

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Kinda too bad it wasn't done earlier..... I get the feeling a lot of what we shooters do is reactionary. We don't proactively go out there and pass laws like this in the first place, which would help us avoid having to fight this stuff later on. Even the NRA seems rather reactionary. We need to be PROACTIVE and prevent these kinda bills from even being proposed.

Guys this is a good idea bit too limited!!! We need to think bigger. It needs to state that ALL gun control measures proposed by the Senate or House have to be voted on by the people. We don't want to fight this one by one. We should have to be the final vote not this or any other Govenor.

But what happens when we're out numbered? Then we're really screwed and we won't have a constitutional argument, at least at the state level, to be made. Sounds like it might be a risky plan.

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Originally Posted by ghettoblaster

Kinda too bad it wasn't done earlier..... I get the feeling a lot of what we shooters do is reactionary. We don't proactively go out there and pass laws like this in the first place, which would help us avoid having to fight this stuff later on. Even the NRA seems rather reactionary. We need to be PROACTIVE and prevent these kinda bills from even being proposed.

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I think that the majority of us:

1. Vote for candidates we feel most closely hold our beliefs, therefore we feel that our beliefs, rights will be upheld.
2. Are a bit in shock over the depths of depravity the Democrat party has slunk to in such a short time.
3. Did not foresee how Marxist the Democrat party would move, so fast and so brazenly to attempt to dismantle the Constitution.

One glimmer of hope I see is that now the mask is off the Democrat party. We now see the face of evil and can identify it.

Now we need to unmask the Republican party for the evil they are and do, although in my opinion they are not as bad as the Democrats, but still heading down the wrong path.

I agree. Both political parties have stepped in it. Throwing stones in glass houses just gets everybody cut. Right now the Dems are stepping in neck deep. From guns, to drones, to soft drinks the WTF flag is getting raised pretty high. America is not a Democracy or popular election would determine who is the president. Neither is it a Republic, as is commonly stated, or representatives would be picked by an aristocracy not us. It is a Democratic Republic in which we democratically elect our representatives. The problem is the Democrats think this is a republic in which they don't answer to the people but to their party line instead of We the People. As for 'but what happens when we are out numbered!'.... That is how the government works. They came up prohibition, realized it was dead wrong and repealed it. That was at the Constitutional level. That does not mean that a vocal minority is supposed to take a point tragedy and use it to their advantage. This needs to be the will of the people. Not a gerrymandered BS dictation from one political party. If you want to keep your guns include more people. Don't turn away somebody asking questions or trying to understand the issues. I was out shooting some of my newest acquisitions at the Cherry Creek range yesterday. I am sorry but I missed the names of this story. One of the guys that runs the place was talking about how he saw one of the Senators was having a real issue voting for the 'responsibility' bill. Instead of attacking he wrote a letter and gave it to a Republican Senator to give to her. I don't know what was in it but she is the one that voted for it but then changed her vote. That bill is now dead (for at least this term). Senator Todd is terrified of guns but she agreed to go shooting with some of us. Unfortunately she still voted for those bills but this is how we bring them over. The votes have been close. Do not cast away the wayward lamb. Bring it into the fold!