Nelson Mandella has died

[Aloha_Shooter]

Wow--he went full RINOtard!

I generally dislike Gingrich but no, this statement was not "RINOtard". He's absolutely right about this one.

[Skip]

I generally dislike Gingrich but no, this statement was not "RINOtard". He's absolutely right about this one.

I would suggest you do some reading...

http://americanfreepress.net/?p=11873

The portrayal of a peace loving man who unified SA is a work of fiction. The man was a monster who was offered the choice to renounce violence for his freedom; he refused. He, like all Communists, requires the deaths of millions to get what he wants. And the bloodshed isn't over.

[snip]

By the way, how many of you have been to SA or dealt one-on-one with South Afrikaners recently? Yes there's crime, particularly in Jo'burg. I was in Jo'burg 4.5 years ago and advised to not leave myself isolated in a parking lot or leave the hotel grounds after dark but I had no problems walking around a shopping mall. SA seemed to me to have a viable economy -- not without its problems but they don't have some buffoon who thinks he can spend 40% more than he takes in forever without consequence either. Trying to understand their current situation from a handful of news accounts is like trying to understand the US from a handful of reports on knockout "games" and the Trayvon Martin case.

I have worked with two contractors who both fled SA for their lives--one working on his citizenship and the other married an American. Neither one will talk about it openly for fear of political correctness/judgment.

Your characterization is another gross misrepresentation. What's happening in SA is a quiet genocide. To equate this with excessive consumer spending is "interesting" (for lack of a respectful word).

http://www.genocidewatch.org/southafrica.html

I would kindly like to inform you about the ongoing white genocide in the Republic of South-Africa. Since 1994, the end of the so-called Apartheid, whites people, especially white farmers, have been subject to extremely brutal and racist murders. About 50 people on average are murdered in South-Africa per day, of which at least 20 of them are whites(95+ % black on white murder rate). Please take into consideration that white people make up only 9% (4 500 000) of the demographics in South-Africa and therefore the white murder rate in South-Africa is quite significant.

This is Mandela's legacy and the fruit of his labor. To say he's not responsible for this when he started the practice as President is ridiculous. Trying to relate what this terrorist did to our founders is downright offensive (as the RINO did).

Did George Washington, Patrick Henry, or Thomas Jefferson do this?




Some of you are very confused--and there are folks hoping you stay confused.

[Aloha_Shooter]

I would suggest you do some reading...

http://americanfreepress.net/?p=11873

The portrayal of a peace loving man who unified SA is a work of fiction. The man was a monster who was offered the choice to renounce violence for his freedom; he refused. He, like all Communists, requires the deaths of millions to get what he wants. And the bloodshed isn't over.

I've read it. I was also reading the press articles contemporaneously during the Soweto Uprisings, de Klerk's reign, and Mandela's ascension to the presidency. The fact of the matter is that Mandela had every opportunity to be the bitter divisionist that Obama has been, to seek "revenge" as the New Black Panther Party has, etc. and he didn't. Yes, he was a bitter violent foe of apartheid but he didn't go past that when he got what he wanted (the end of apartheid). Yes, he made mistakes along the way like aligning with the Soviets, something I neither forgive nor forget.

I have worked with two contractors who both fled SA for their lives--one working on his citizenship and the other married an American. Neither one will talk about it openly for fear of political correctness/judgment.

Your characterization is another gross misrepresentation. What's happening in SA is a quiet genocide. To equate this with excessive consumer spending is "interesting" (for lack of a respectful word).

http://www.genocidewatch.org/southafrica.html



This is Mandela's legacy and the fruit of his labor. To say he's not responsible for this when he started the practice as President is ridiculous. Trying to relate what this terrorist did to our founders is downright offensive (as the RINO did).

Did George Washington, Patrick Henry, or Thomas Jefferson do this?




Some of you are very confused--and there are folks hoping you stay confused.

My dealings have hardly been a statistical representation but I've met and talked with young SAers in SA. Yes, there's quite a bit of political correctness in how they talk but they come from a different demographic -- non-farmer Afrikaners. As I said, you're confusing Nelson Mandela with Zuma, Winnie Mandela (don't get me started on that beeyatch), and others. The violence you're talking about has got significantly worse in Zuma's reign as Mandela got sick and even your sources predict an uptick now that Mandela is dead. I wonder why that is if Mandela hadn't been a force against the racist thefts and murders? I look at Mandela as I do Menachem Begin who also started as a terrorist by anyone's definition. That's why I oppose his deification but it would be equally wrong to deny that he consistently tried to chart a peaceful path for SA. By the way, 20/50 is a 40% rate, not 95%, but I do expect it to be worse in more recent years.

[Skip]

I've read it. I was also reading the press articles contemporaneously during the Soweto Uprisings, de Klerk's reign, and Mandela's ascension to the presidency. The fact of the matter is that Mandela had every opportunity to be the bitter divisionist that Obama has been, to seek "revenge" as the New Black Panther Party has, etc. and he didn't. Yes, he was a bitter violent foe of apartheid but he didn't go past that when he got what he wanted (the end of apartheid). Yes, he made mistakes along the way like aligning with the Soviets, something I neither forgive nor forget.

My belief is Mandela got this out of his system in the early days with the ANC. Then when the world was watching he turned into a saint.

This is why he was imprisoned in the first place.

You have a great point with the comparison to Obama! But like in the US currently, there is an awkward understanding of what is too far that is often negotiated out of plain sight. Unlike Obama, Mandela actually to work his way into the Presidency.

My dealings have hardly been a statistical representation but I've met and talked with young SAers in SA. Yes, there's quite a bit of political correctness in how they talk but they come from a different demographic -- non-farmer Afrikaners. As I said, you're confusing Nelson Mandela with Zuma, Winnie Mandela (don't get me started on that beeyatch), and others. The violence you're talking about has got significantly worse in Zuma's reign as Mandela got sick and even your sources predict an uptick now that Mandela is dead. I wonder why that is if Mandela hadn't been a force against the racist thefts and murders? I look at Mandela as I do Menachem Begin who also started as a terrorist by anyone's definition. That's why I oppose his deification but it would be equally wrong to deny that he consistently tried to chart a peaceful path for SA. By the way, 20/50 is a 40% rate, not 95%, but I do expect it to be worse in more recent years.

Mandela as a stabilizing force? Maybe. And maybe because he understands the consequences of a questionable legacy. Maybe because he is offsetting his formative years.

The folks I have talked to have laid it out exactly as I have read it. The writing is on the wall no matter what. They chose to leave while they could still sell their property. The crime is constant and the police often look the other way--even with serious crimes against persons. Whites are walling themselves in, turning their homes into compounds. There are no neighboring countries that will take them in.

I believe there are two stats the source quoted; murders by race and then murderers by race. Yes, 40% of the people killed are whites (in a country where only 9% are white) but they are killed by blacks 95% of the time. This is in spite of the increased security and awareness. This is a genocide and it has been since 1994.

At the end of the day, there will be people who paint this as black and white. It's Mandela or Apartheid; therefore they praise Mandela. Nothing could be more false. Apartheid was evil. So was Mandela's response to it and their legacy will continue to be racial strife, injustice, and genocide.

[RMAC757]

My belief is Mandela got this out of his system in the early days with the ANC. Then when the world was watching he turned into a saint.

This is why he was imprisoned in the first place.

You have a great point with the comparison to Obama! But like in the US currently, there is an awkward understanding of what is too far that is often negotiated out of plain sight. Unlike Obama, Mandela actually to work his way into the Presidency.




Mandela as a stabilizing force? Maybe. And maybe because he understands the consequences of a questionable legacy. Maybe because he is offsetting his formative years.

The folks I have talked to have laid it out exactly as I have read it. The writing is on the wall no matter what. They chose to leave while they could still sell their property. The crime is constant and the police often look the other way--even with serious crimes against persons. Whites are walling themselves in, turning their homes into compounds. There are no neighboring countries that will take them in.

I believe there are two stats the source quoted; murders by race and then murderers by race. Yes, 40% of the people killed are whites (in a country where only 9% are white) but they are killed by blacks 95% of the time. This is in spite of the increased security and awareness. This is a genocide and it has been since 1994.

At the end of the day, there will be people who paint this as black and white. It's Mandela or Apartheid; therefore they praise Mandela. Nothing could be more false. Apartheid was evil. So was Mandela's response to it and their legacy will continue to be racial strife, injustice, and genocide.

I wonder what the murder rates were along racial lines during Germany from 1938-1945? Did the international community subject and divide Germany ( well at least the western half ) along racial lines to keep to peace post National Socialism? 6 million Jews were murdered. Would the rounding up of and displacing of the German people while creating a separate set of laws based on their history of violence solve anything in the long run? Racial violence isn't the domain of any one particular group.