RUFKM? Judge orders Colorado Cake Maker to serve gay couples

[Madeinhb]

it's not the product that matters really, it's the fact that a business is open to provide a service.

Until today's abomination of a ruling, the right to refuse service only applied to no shoes, no shirt no service/lack of proper attire, customers who got unruly/disorderly/violent, customers who disrupted the normal flow of business (i.e. were extremely filthy, contagious or smelling foul).

Anything else was considered discrimination.

This man's religious beliefs have absolutely nothing to do with baking a cake for a gay couple.

You're in business to provide a service. not pick and choose who you want to serve based on your mentally delusional sky daddy belief system that the majority of the public doesn't buy into.

Now if his business had been a membership only business, he could pick and choose who he wants to serve. SCOTUS dropped the ball big time.




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Playing Devils advocate here. Say as an argument I'm an artist and I'm being asked to commission a painting of a guy couple naked spooning. Now if I do not accept the contract - is that discrimination?

It's their private business. This whole he is in a service to the public isn't exactly true. He is only the owner as long as it's beneficial to him. Let's say he changes $10 for a cake. Now the government says he has to charge $5. Now it's not beneficial to him and he will close. He owes nothing to people, and people owe him nothing. That's how a capitalistic society works.


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[TheGrey]

As a business owner, I'll decide who I am going to provide service to, and who I will not. Period.


You are clearly missing the point- baking cakes is WHAT HE DOES. It is his form of advertising his business, which is to say that he supports whatever ceebration the baked goods was created for. He's not Walmart; he's an artist.

The two went past several bakeries to target this bakery. If it was just a cake, why didnt they get one from somewhere else?

And as far as "religious BS"....I suggest you take a long look at the history of this country and its Constitutional foundations, Ms. Planning-to-be-a Lawyer. Start with religious freedoms. Your dismissiveness of a person's belief- while DEMANDING that everyone not challenge your particular beliefs- is quite telling.

[BushMasterBoy]

The actual decision from the Supreme Court official website below. I once heard somebody say "The law is not based on logic, but experience."


https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinion...1_new_d1of.pdf

[TheGrey]

The actual decision from the Supreme Court official website below. I once heard somebody say "The law is not based on logic, but experience."


https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinion...1_new_d1of.pdf

" To Phillips, his claim that using his artistic
skills to make an expressive statement, a wedding endorsement in
his own voice and of his own creation, has a significant First
Amendment speech component and implicates his deep and sincere
religious beliefs. His dilemma was understandable in 2012, which
was before Colorado recognized the validity of gay marriages performed
in the State and before this Court issued United States v.
Windsor, 570 U. S. 744, or Obergefell. Given the State’s position at
the time, there is some force to Phillips’ argument that he was not
unreasonable in deeming his decision lawful."

Thanks for the link!

[CoGirl303]

As a business owner, I'll decide who I am going to provide service to, and who I will not. Period.

You are cleary issing the point- baking cakes is WHAT HE DOES. It is his form of advertising his business, which is to say that he supports whatever ceebration the baked goods was created for. He's not Walmart; he's an artist.

The two went past several bakeries to target this bakery. If it was just a cake, why didnt they get one from somewhere else?

And as far as "religious BS"....I suggest you take a long look at the history of this country and its Constitutional foundations, Ms. Planning-to-be-a Lawyer. Start with religious freedoms. Your dismissiveness of a person's belief- while DEMANDING that everyone not challenge your particular beliefs- is quite telling.

I don't care what anyone's beliefs are personally. They do what what they want, just leave me out of it. I don't ask, suggest or implore anyone to be an atheist and I certainly don't go recruiting people to become atheists and I'm not demanding anything.

But about twice a month I get knocks on my door asking me if I know Jesus, do I want to become a Jehovah's witness and blah blah blah. I get it at restaurants, the mall, out for a walk. Even the Muslims don't knock on my door or come up and try to recruit me. But Christians and Baptists, Catholics and Mormons and 7th Day Adventists are all up in everyone's face, personal space and business and in an oppressive, obnoxious manner.

I doubt they targeted the baker. I have yet to see any proof of that. Just speculation as far as I'm concerned. Just because they chose not to go to another baker, doesn't mean they targeted anyone in particular.

[BPTactical]

He wasnt forced to endorse anything. He was asked to bake a cake! He wasnt asked to ordain the wedding ceremony. He wasn't asked to join them in matrimony. Although Craig and Mullins had been "married" a year earlier in Massachusetts and had "researched" numerous other establishments prior to focusing on Masterpiece Bakery. Stinks of "Activists"

He refused them only because they were gay and that is the definition of discrimination.
PHILLIPS DID NOT REFUSE SERVICE, he happily offered them ANY item as long as it was not a wedding cake.THAT IS NOT DISCRIMINATION, selective service possibly but that is not discriminatory nor unlawfull
His religious bs has no place being used to decide which customer to serve or place limitations upon which services he will render to whom based on their sexuality.

His religious views are his and his alone. Not to be imposed upon anyone else. Just as the views of the LBGTQ crowd are not to be IMPOSED upon anyone else.




The right to religious freedom is a personal one. You can worship as you please, choose your religion, your God, place of worship (church), whatever.

But it should not be allowable to weaponize your religion to the point where you deny someone a service at a business that is open to the general public. Then explain the numerous Muslim establishments that have denied service to gays and not one word said nor suit filed.

In the case of the Colorado baker. he weaponized his religion and used it to discriminate against a couple only because they were gay. So we "Straight' people have to just sit back and suck on it when the LBGTQ crowd weaponizes their genitalia and DEMAND we accept their "alternative lifestyle" i.e. mental illness as normal?
Fuck That Shit

What do you on your own time is your business. Forcing your belief system others is bovine scatology You mean just like a gay couple attempted to do to another?and that's exactly what happened in this case.




it's not quite that simple.

https://www.legalzoom.com/articles/t...-of-appearance

The hell it isn't. You walk into my establishment and I don't like the way you look, your body language, your verbiage, you give me the wrong vibe I will assuredly deny you service. I have a legal obligation to take reasonable means to ensure that the products I deal with are used in a responsible manner by responsible persons and I have legal precedence backing me.


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In this post we learn that life isn't Burger King.
You can't have it your way ALL the time.

[TheGrey]

I don't care what anyone's beliefs are personally. They do what what they want, just leave me out of it. I don't ask, suggest or implore anyone to be an atheist and I certainly don't go recruiting people to become atheists and I'm not demanding anything.

But about twice a month I get knocks on my door asking me if I know Jesus, do I want to become a Jehovah's witness and blah blah blah. I get it at restaurants, the mall, out for a walk. Even the Muslims don't knock on my door or come up and try to recruit me. But Christians and Baptists, Catholics and Mormons and 7th Day Adventists are all up in everyone's face, personal space and business and in an oppressive, obnoxious manner.

I doubt they targeted the baker. I have yet to see any proof of that. Just speculation as far as I'm concerned. Just because they chose not to go to another baker, doesn't mean they targeted anyone in particular.

Really? If you didn't care what anyone's beliefs are personally, then why say this?

"This man's religious beliefs have absolutely nothing to do with baking a cake for a gay couple.

You're in business to provide a service. not pick and choose who you want to serve based on your mentally delusional sky daddy belief system that the majority of the public doesn't buy into. "

That's incredibly insulting to anyone that has a Christian background. Your opinion has been aired, and you'll reap what you've sown- not matter how frantically you backpedal now.

You get a lot of religious solicitors? I can understand that frustration. Instead of insulting people here, you COULD go on Amazon, purchase "No religious soliciting" and "No Trespassing" signs and hang them on your door.

Frankly, I'm tired of having people's sexual choices waved in my face no matter where I go. It's on every channel, tons of movies, etc. etc. But hey, it's better than living somewhere that restricts basic freedoms and beliefs, isn't it?

[opie011]

In this post we learn that life isn't Burger King.
You can't have it your way ALL the time.

Best one yet

[Gman]

Frankly, I'm tired of having people's sexual choices waved in my face no matter where I go. It's on every channel, tons of movies, etc. etc. But hey, it's better than living somewhere that restricts basic freedoms and beliefs, isn't it?

No kidding. I don't care if you're straight, gay, whatever.

Freedom of speech or religion is not freedom from being offended. If you don't agree with a baker not wanting to make your cake, find another one that will cater to what you want.

[CoGirl303]

No kidding. I don't care if you're straight, gay, whatever.

Freedom of speech or religion is not freedom from being offended. If you don't agree with a baker not wanting to make your cake, find another one that will cater to what you want.

Why should they have to go somewhere else?

Really? If you didn't care what anyone's beliefs are personally, then why say this?

"This man's religious beliefs have absolutely nothing to do with baking a cake for a gay couple.

You're in business to provide a service. not pick and choose who you want to serve based on your mentally delusional sky daddy belief system that the majority of the public doesn't buy into. "

That's incredibly insulting to anyone that has a Christian background. Your opinion has been aired, and you'll reap what you've sown- not matter how frantically you backpedal now.

You get a lot of religious solicitors? I can understand that frustration. Instead of insulting people here, you COULD go on Amazon, purchase "No religious soliciting" and "No Trespassing" signs and hang them on your door.

Frankly, I'm tired of having people's sexual choices waved in my face no matter where I go. It's on every channel, tons of movies, etc. etc. But hey, it's better than living somewhere that restricts basic freedoms and beliefs, isn't it?

I'm struggling to see what a persons personal religious beliefs have to do with running a business that is open to the general public?

When someone walks into a business they aren't thinking about "what is this person's religion?"

They are interested in the product, is this person honest, do they have integrity and is this a quality product, do they take pride in their work?

Yes and being constantly recruited is incredibly insulting to me. Why would I backpedal?

The signs aren't allowed by my apt complex (all that uniformity stuff in the lease). (I cant even put an window unit a/c in my bedroom window of which the room is oppressively hot.)

You can't deny people service because they are black. or hispanic. or asian. Why should gay people be denied service?


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