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It's legal everywhere but Denver. I'm not sure if that is the Denver city limits or Denver County. They may be one and the same.Originally Posted by Eow
Policies like this are one of the reasons me and the family don't do business with Denver.
It's both the city and county
Your examples are so weak foxtrot. I can't believe, that you honestly believe, that some guy running into a store intent on mowing down his girlfriend is even going to notice someone who is open carrying. Have you ever been to an IDPA match? Half the people there are open carrying. When you look at the crowd, they look just like any other group of people. I noticed this at the IDPA match I was at. I have a few pictures of the crowd, and you have to actively look for holsters to even realize anyone is carrying.
The armed security guard is a weak example as well. You're comparing someone who is not only uniformed, but posted in a purposely visible position as a deterrent, to someone who is doing the same thing as every other customer in the place.
If concealed carry were the best way to carry, then police and military would conceal as well.
"There are no finger prints under water."
Thats not to mention that you are a lot more likley to encounter a petty theft burgler situation, than you are a suicidal situation.
Assault is a type of behavior, not a type of hardware.
I don't really open carry.
Its fine if you open carry. The listed reasons are sound - in fact they are suspiciously similar to the reasons for carrying in general, minus the $300 or so of money you have to pay the .gov for the pleasure of letting your coat fall over your holster.
All seems a bit silly to me. To my knowledge there has been no systematic study of the risks of open carry vs concealed carry, so it falls to the individual to look around, think on it logically themselves, and make a decision as to whether its worth it to open or concealed carry (or carry at all, as foreign as the idea is to me.)
Regardless, +1 person carrying in the world, open or concealed, makes the world just that much safer. And thats more important than arguments about which is better.
As far as that topic goes, open carry is a touch faster (though if someone notices and is *still* intent on being malicious, which is rare even among the relatively low chance of you being around armed thugs, you do make yourself a big honkin' target - but the argument that this is a marginal consideration at best is perfectly valid) concealed carry is less of a hassle, potentially. Go with whichever one you feel more comfortable with.
It only take one event though. OC or not.. we just have to be aware of the surrounding all the time.. go into paranoid mode then tad it back a bit. Yep.. that much.
I can certainly see the flawed logic in believing that open carry will deter all crime. I should have made it clear that I didn't bother to read this (or any of the other "articles") posted by the OP, because I've read them all before. I should have tailored my response to better explain that my only point in posting in any of these open carry threads, is to point out that saying that "open carry makes you a target," is stupid.
If some dudes want to rob a couple walking down the street, but there is a bar half a block down with a big bouncer standing outside, those dudes aren't going to go after the buff bouncer first, then rob the couple. They are just going to rob the couple and run.
The grocery store example is still weak, because you are talking about unarmed people, who would be required to close the gap and come into physical contact with the guy. An armed citizen is not as likely to be in that situation.
I guess my main hang up is that people use some movie example of a team of 10 ex-military guys doing an organized hit on a bank while you are open carrying in the lobby. Those guys may think to neutralize you, but you wouldn't stand much more of a chance if you were carrying concealed either; unless you didn't draw the gun at all. Even though NOT drawing would be likely, and the smart thing to do, it's the same as not having a gun at all.
I conceal carry instead of open carry, but you'll never catch me telling someone that they shouldn't open carry, because there is no reason to tell anyone that.
"There are no finger prints under water."
Thats the worst argument possible.
By that logic, everyone assumes all unarmed citizens are armed. Police and military are assumed to be armed. There is no concealment or blending in when there is no choice in the matter.
And most off duty cops do carry concealed... last I checked.
Oh, and your absolutely correct, petty theft happens more often. That's akin to saying, fender benders happen more often then fatal car accidents, so don't worry about wearing your seat belt as it PROBABLY won't happen.
And, your right, someone would PROBABLY overlook an open carry, if they were PROBABLY in a hurry. For that matter, if they are PROBABLY going to overlook it, exactly how the hell does it deter crime in the first place? You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Personally, I don't like to risk my personal safety on "PROBABLY". but, thats a difference of opinion.
Another factor you will see with a lot of concealed carry folk is they don't like other people - gun owners included - to know they carry, or where they carry, or often, what they carry. They want the information on how they will defend themselves, or if they will defend themselves, to be cutoff from the world, in the unlikely (but possible) event, someone is ever bent on coming after them. If you always open carry a 45 on your left side in a black holster on your belt, everyone in your life is going to know it. Typically, strangers don't kill strangers, and if someone is pissed off enough to come after you (not to steal your watch) they are going to have the advance intel to know exactly what your reaction would be. Will that prevent them from acting? maybe. Will that limit your options if it doesn't?You really won't have any.
The problem with open carry, is not that it will deter some crime.. sure it will. It's what happens if it doesn't? You can't be naive enough to think having a gun on your belt will deter 100% of people out there. In the event someone notices it before hand, and it does not deter them (cause and effect) your a goner. Unless your Psychic and know what everybody is going to do, concealed or open carry is always REACTIVE. You can't act until a thread has become apparent, and in this event, that threat will not have become apparent until it (possibly) kills you.
Also, the difference between me and the guy who wrote the original article? I don't place bets on what will or won't happen. Fact of the matter is, whatever happens will always catch you off guard, and you can't predict it. There are millions of potential situations that can happen. Only a small fraction fit in with the OP's article-writer's intention. Almost none will you have any mental preparation or advanced warning.
That grocery store example? That happened. this city, about ten years ago. Two unarmed men tried to stop him, he shot both before they even had a chance. Then his girlfriend. Then himself. Weak example? It's called LIFE. Would he have noticed an open carry? I won't guess either way, the possibility exists. He didn't come in guns blazing. He caught the entire store off guard. I do know he would not have been deterred by one (and that a concealed carry, or an unnoticed open carry, would both have had the chance to stop him, and save 3 lives that day)
The original article has been written with the mindset that EVERYTHING can be deterred with open carry. That by carrying openly, a person will NEVER have to use it. Can you not see the flawed logic?
When it all comes down to it, it's a matter of personal opinion. I'm not saying you should not open carry. That's your right and your choice. I'm saying the O.Post has a very limited perspective on the situation and doesn't represent the full picture, and both sides of the issue.
Much better post than your rant. I can see some of the things you are saying. I just feel the public needs to be educated that it is legal for me to carry a gun. That is why I am going to open carry for a while. I prefer not to draw attention to myself and that is the reason I will probably go back to concealed carry after I feel I have done my part to educate the public. Unless during my experiment with open carry I decide it is better than concealed. Right now OC is kind of a trip!
open carry?
the fact that it scares the sheeple and pisses off the liberals is more than enough reason for me.
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