Close
Page 5 of 16 FirstFirst 1234567891015 ... LastLast
Results 41 to 50 of 154
  1. #41
    Newbie, or Trading Post Troll
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Birmingham, AL
    Posts
    117

    Default

    Excellent article that we can all learn from. This should be required reading for anyone that carries a firearm for protection and should be included in CCW curriculum. There are many more OIS reports where assailants absorb multiple rounds and continue the fight. My hats off to Gramins.

    For anyone that didn't click through to the rest of the article here are more quotes by Gramins that BuffaloBo is referring to:

    "
    Sgt. Timothy Gramins who fired 17 .45-cal. rounds into a hell-bent suspect before putting him down offers these lessons learned from his extraordinary fight for his life:
    1.) Beef up your ammo reserves. “A lot more rounds are being exchanged in today’s gunfights than in the past. With offenders carrying heavier weapons, going on patrol with just a handgun and two extra magazines no longer cuts it. Carry more ammo. Always have a backup gun. Carry a loaded rifle where you can reach it. I can’t express how quickly your firearm will go empty when you’re shooting for real. There’s no worse feeling than pulling the trigger and hearing it go ‘click’.”
    2.) Practice head shots. “When you fire multiple ‘lethal’ rounds into an attacker and he keeps going, you don’t have the luxury of waiting 20 or 40 more seconds for him to die while he can still shoot at you. Don’t waste time arguing the relative merits of various calibers. No handgun rounds have reliable stopping power with body shots. Pick the round you can shoot best and practice shooting at the suspect’s head.”


    3.) Get addicted to self-improvement. “I realized very quickly after my incident that I wasn’t as good as I ought to be. You should never consider yourself ‘good enough.’ If you have a chance to get to any school, even on your own dime, study what’s going on out there and how to deal with it. Most of the training entries on my resume came after my shooting. I’m constantly thinking, ‘When is my next one?’ And ‘Will I be as prepared as I need to be?’ ”

    4.) Fight for something. “To overcome the evil that wants to defeat you, you have to have something you’re fighting for. What do you care most about? You have to want to win for that more than anything else in the world. It’s going to come down to the strength of motivation: the subject’s determination to kill you versus your determination to stop him. Your turn will come — there’s no doubt in my mind about that any more — and you can’t afford to lose.”

    5.) Read for recovery. “After my shooting, I had some hard days, some things in my head that I had to get sorted out and work my way through. There were two books in particular that were tremendously helpful: Deadly Force Encounters: What Cops Need to Know to Mentally and Physically Prepare for and Survive a Gunfight, by Dr. Alexis Artwohl and Loren Christensen, and On Combat, by Lt. Col. David Grossman. They’re mandatory reading if using or receiving deadly force is part of your job description, because they bring clarity to what’s going on in your body and your brain.”
    6.) Bonus tips. Wear glasses when you’re on patrol, even if they’re just clear lenses. They’ll help protect your eyes. If you can’t see, you can’t fight.
    Shoot at targets that have clothes on them. Hits are sometimes harder to see with clothing than when you’re shooting paper. Knowing that in advance will keep your confidence up in a gunfight.
    Seek out force-on-force Simunitions training. Get accustomed to seeing guns pointed at you and fired at you — and firing back to win without hesitation. You’ll be better prepared than officers who experience this for the first time on the street and scramble to comprehend that their life is actually on the line.”"

  2. #42

    Default

    I have never been in a fire fight or ever want to be but I dont see how you can say how you will react when faced with death until you are in that situation.. This officer was very well trained, maybe he wasnt a mighty comp shooter but he was no beat cop just out of the academy. Sure you can stand behind a plywood wall and take your time aiming at a steel plate because you know all it will cost you is time, if you miss you just have to fire again and time is lost. Well imagine that the plate is shooting back and you may not want to take as long to aim and that time you missed you could be dead. To me it seems like a good idea to take any shot that may distract him with pain and ruin his concentration enough for me to get to a better spot to be able to take a more calculated shot. Even a guy firing wildly only needs to get lucky once, it could be his first shot, who knows. Just the sound of gunfire is enough to throw most everyone off their game.

    Google russian special forces training and watch some of their live fire exercises where they get shot in the chest of their vest and then have to draw and fire at a target inches away from another mans head. I wouldnt want to be either one of those guys.
    Last edited by dirtrulz; 05-07-2014 at 08:05.

  3. #43
    Guest
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Westminster, CO
    Posts
    2,741

    Default


  4. #44
    Machine Gunner KestrelBike's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Omaha, NE
    Posts
    2,341

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by blacklabel View Post
    Says he isn't trolling, proceeds to troll some more.

    Can we have you shoot a match while I shoot SIMUNITIONS at you?
    FIFY

  5. #45
    Machine Gunner Jeffrey Lebowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Golden
    Posts
    1,615

    Default

    I'm disappointed no mention that the 10mm would've brought him down.



    In all seriousness, very interesting read. Thanks, OP, for posting it.
    Obviously not a golfer.

  6. #46
    Glock Armorer for sexual favors Jer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Loveland, CO
    Posts
    6,245

    Default

    People ask me regularly what they should carry and why. My reply often is whichever gun they can hammer fire through a mag the fastest and maintain the smallest group. You can train all you want and envision every possible scenario your mind can think of and the reality is that when your life is actually on the line and you get that adrenaline dump that's exactly what you're going to be doing no matter how cool of a cucumber you think you are. Now, if by some miracle you're able to slow down and take your time then that's wonderful and you're not out anything. Plan for the worst and hope for the best.

    This invariably is 9mm over 40 & 45 for most. You also get higher capacity (more chances at that perfect shot in the same size frame) and another consideration is the cost & availability of ammo.

    With advancements in ammo technology the playing field has been leveled. Keep in mind that handgun calibers just poke small holes so I want to poke more holes and have more opportunities to poke holes in the right things to stop the threat.

    The idea that .45acp is a better defense round than 9mm has never been more false than it is today.

    Train with what you carry and be proficient with whatever it is. Then be aware of your surroundings and avoid potential bad situations as this is these most important things you can do regardless of what caliber you choose.

    Edit: I forgot to mention that I tell people the second most important factor to consider aside from what I mentioned at the start of this post is which firearm you shoot the most accurately over your weak-side shoulder while fleeing. If there's an exit strategy available to you this becomes your new primary plan of survival.
    Last edited by Jer; 05-07-2014 at 09:21.
    I'm not fat, I'm tactically padded.
    Tactical Commander - Fast Action Response Team (F.A.R.T.)
    For my feedback Click Here.
    Click: For anyone with a dog or pets, please read

  7. #47
    Auditech10
    Guest

    Default

    Very good read!
    Im not going to comment on taking headshots except for the rule of knowing whats beyond your target. Thats all I can think about when I read some of these comments.
    Cheers

  8. #48
    Machine Gunner Jamnanc's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Johnstown
    Posts
    1,671

    Default

    With a 357 sig, he could have shot through the car. Problem solved.

  9. #49
    The "Godfather" of COAR Great-Kazoo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Washboard Alley, AZ.
    Posts
    48,077

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tor Larson View Post
    Real tough shooting non-living targets that don't shoot back, dodge, move randomly, and want to kill you. Wonder how the expert would do if he was tossed suddenly into a real life situation without a video camera recording his daring exploits to be posted on Youtube? Fear, stress, and adrenaline are game changers-no matter how much practice on the range a person never really knows how they will respond/act/move. Thank the gods that the officer survived. Glad they are out there doing a nasty job.

    There was a debate 2 yrs ago? here regarding the CCW holder not engaging the shooter across the parking lot.
    Cstone did a put up or shut up shhot @ pawnee. The ones who said I could have taken the shot were 90% no shows. Those who did participate , lets say a consistent 65 yd shot with a hand gun was proven to be a bust.
    The Great Kazoo's Feedback

    "when you're happy you enjoy the melody but, when you're broken you understand the lyrics".

  10. #50
    QUITTER Irving's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    46,527
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tor Larson View Post
    Real tough shooting non-living targets that don't shoot back, dodge, move randomly, and want to kill you. Wonder how the expert would do if he was tossed suddenly into a real life situation without a video camera recording his daring exploits to be posted on Youtube? Fear, stress, and adrenaline are game changers-no matter how much practice on the range a person never really knows how they will respond/act/move. Thank the gods that the officer survived. Glad they are out there doing a nasty job.
    So no need to practice all then, is what you're saying?
    "There are no finger prints under water."

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •