Cruz, Rubio, and Jindal are all ineligible to be President - Not Natural Born Citizens of the US

[Aloha_Shooter]

Actually, yes, an anchor baby could run for POTUS much as you or I might hate the concept. Cruz was born a US citizen despite the locale of his birth by virtue of his mother's citizenship. That's been clear from the nation's birth. What the Founding Fathers wanted to avoid was someone like Arnold Schwarzenegger or Liam Neeson moving to the country and running for the head office.

Obama's anti-American attitude was due to how and where he was RAISED, not where he was or wasn't born. I have never bought into the birther argument simply because his mother was a citizen so it didn't matter. I think he's used it as a useful distraction and way to poke fun at people who oppose him. What people should have objected to was the fact he was RAISED by anti-American communists. He doesn't understand American culture or heritage because it's something he had to read about rather than live.

BTW, neither Cruz nor McCain are the first to encounter this made-up "issue" and I'll take advice on Constitutional law from Lawrence Tribe when I become an Obamabot.

[davsel]

The founding father's were not just concerned about someone raised in another country. They were also concerned about the parentage of the individual - specifically the father. Their concern is over eliminating, or at least minimizing, any allegiance or ties to any country other than the U.S. As I stated before, it bother's me when Cruze and Rubio speak so fondly of their ancestral country of Cuba. Because, when you combine that with their previous open border immigration (they've changed there tune a bit recently) beliefs, it makes perfect sense to me why the founders included this requirement and meant for it to be much stricter than presently reported.

Just look at what has happened when we allowed a Muslim sympathizer with questionable lineage into the top position of our Govt. - We now have Muslim Brotherhood members in all branches of our own govt, and God knows what all he has allowed and accomplished through his Muslim foreign policy over the past seven years. If it can be unwound, it will take decades.

There is no shortage of "natural born" Americans to choose from for the position of President. People who not only put America first, but have no ties to any other country.

[Ronin13]

Ok, one more time:

No one is arguing whether or not Cruz was a US citizen at the time of his birth - He was and is.

The argument stems from the fact that there are two different "classes" of citizenship: "Natural Born" and "Naturalized." The only difference between members of these two classes is that one can run for POTUS and the other class cannot.

"Natural Born" = born within the confines or jurisdiction of the United States to a citizen parent.
"Naturalized" = A statute or act of Congress confers citizenship to someone other than the "Natural Born" citizen.

Cruz was not born within the confines or jurisdiction of the United States, therefore his citizenship, from the time of his birth, falls under the class of "Naturalized" because it required a legal statute to grant citizenship to children of US citizens born outside the US - as you posted above.

What you have posted above falls under "Naturalized," and therefore is ineligible to hold the office of POTUS.

The subject has been brought up by the courts before:
https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/169/649


Being a citizen at birth is not the same thing as being a "Natural Born" citizen.

Just a little issue- by your logic then McCain wouldn't have been eligible to run for POTUS... And they decided that he was. Since he was born in Panama.

[davsel]

Just a little issue- by your logic then McCain wouldn't have been eligible to run for POTUS... And they decided that he was. Since he was born in Panama.

There's a bit more to it. The United States held sovereignty over the Panama Canal Zone at the time of MCCain's birth. He was born on a U.S. military base, and his parents were U.S. citizens.
Therefore, McCain was born within the jurisdiction of the United States to a citizen parent = "natural born" as stated above.

In McCain's case, the Senate passed a nonbinding resolution stating he was eligible to run for President - hardly precedent setting.

The SCOTUS will eventually have to rule on the meaning of "natural born." Until then, it is all just opinion and argument.

[Ronin13]

The SCOTUS will eventually have to rule on the meaning of "natural born." Until then, it is all just opinion and argument.

Hence the futility of Trump even arguing if they refuse to rule prior to November.

[davsel]

Hence the futility of Trump even arguing if they refuse to rule prior to November.

Indeed.

He would probably have better luck arguing Cruz's wife's position with Goldman Sachs and his questionable financial disclosures.

[Ronin13]

Indeed.

He would probably have better luck arguing Cruz's wife's position with Goldman Sachs and his questionable financial disclosures.

To wit I would expect Cruz to fire back about the bankruptcies in Trump's past, and let's not forget about that time that The Donald gave money to Hillary. No politician is perfect... just some are less perfect than others. By that I mean, and including Trump, everyone is less perfect from the Demonrats choices compared to who's in the running for the Republicans.

[davsel]

Fairnuff

[davsel]

http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=231093

There's a clean question on the table regarding dual citizenship for persons born in Canada prior to 1977 (when they changed their law to officially recognize dual nationality.)

Prior to that date, with few exceptions, you could not hold dual nationality with Canada. In other words the very act of "renouncing" Canadian Citizenship means that Cruz never held US citizenship at birth because his parents had to declare his nationality at the time he was born.

There may be exceptions that were available at the time but the law now is immaterial.

The only material fact is what the law was then, in 1970, in Canada when Cruz was born.

If his parents declared US for him then he had nothing to renounce and he has a document called a Consular Report of Birth Abroad.

This is the legal equivalent of a US Birth Certificate and Cruz either has one from the time of his birth or he does not. If he does not then he is not a US Citizen as he was never naturalized by his own admission and at birth the nation in which he was born did not recognize dual nationality.

Where is that document Cruz? Your mother's birth certificate is immaterial. What matters is whether you were declared a Canadian or US Citizen at birth and what documentation you have to prove it.

You see, in 1970 there was no "and" option.

Cruz either has that Consular Report of Birth Abroad, which is his legal proof of US Citizenship just as my Birth Certificate is mine, or he doesn't and he's not a citizen at all as his parents declared his citizenship as Canadian and the land he were born in prohibited dual nationality at the time.

If he doesn't have that document, of course, there's a little problem with the office Senator Cruz holds now, say much less his running for President.

[Aloha_Shooter]

Whether or not Canada recognized Cruz's US citizenship had no bearing on whether the US did. They are completely different legal systems and the US has recognized the children of US citizens as having US citizenship regardless of where they are born. My brother and sister were both born overseas (before Cruz) but recognized as US citizens from day one. They got naturalization certificates solely to prevent the other country from trying to lay a claim on them but it was never a question as far as US law. We have had mirror cases in the past where country X granted citizenship status to people but the US didn't recognize any dual-citizenship status (including IIRC one very prominent senator and former presidential candidate).

Can we put a rest to this ridiculous line of argument? Say Cruz is an arse but this whole citizenship thing is bogus.