Paperwork Clarification

[BigBear]

When on has a new tool, I know one is supposed to keep the tax stamp COPY with the tool. The original goes into a safe/etc. My question is about the Trust/form whatever paperwork. Does a copy of that also need to reside with the tool when it goes for a walk?

I've tried Google-fu and received conflicting information. Not sure what statues to actually look up... Sorry for the seemingly stupid question.

[DangerLee_Industries]

When on has a new tool, I know one is supposed to keep the tax stamp COPY with the tool. The original goes into a safe/etc. My question is about the Trust/form whatever paperwork. Does a copy of that also need to reside with the tool when it goes for a walk?

I've tried Google-fu and received conflicting information. Not sure what statues to actually look up... Sorry for the seemingly stupid question.

Yes it does.

[BigBear]

Thank you, so just to clarify again:

The copy of the tax Stamp AND a copy of the Trust BOTH need to stay with the NFA item?

[DangerLee_Industries]

Thank you, so just to clarify again:

The copy of the tax Stamp AND a copy of the Trust BOTH need to stay with the NFA item?

Yes

[BigBear]

You Rock Sir. Thank you very much.

[Monky]

Bear I don't agree with Danger but he is the man with the license to sell these things.

I keep copies of my stamps. 1/4 size and laminated when the toys go for a walk, the copies go.

Danger (not saying you're wrong) but where is it required?

[drew890]

I'll piggyback on what Monky said (does). I do the same as he does, not to say Tim is wrong, but in all of my NFA research I've never found direction that requires the trust documents to be present or an actual instance where an ATF agent required that the documents be produced on demand.

[BigBear]

I think this is where the "better to be safe, than sorry" saying comes from. lol

Thanks for the help folks.

[DangerLee_Industries]

Zero offense taken guys that's how these conversations always go.

I am no lawyer and your experience may vary. I'm simply speaking from the personal experience we had with an agent when my pops was approached at a range in Missouri about 5 years ago. He asked him for a copy of the stamps and the associated Trust.

I always error on the side of caution since the Trust in my mind is part of the "Registration" process and since 30ish pieces of paper don't weigh my range bag down I always keep them with.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does...f-registration

[asmo]

I always error on the side of caution since the Trust in my mind is part of the "Registration" process and since 30ish pieces of paper don't weigh my range bag down I always keep them with.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does...f-registration

The approved Form 1/4 is the "application". The trust, in and of itself, is not part of the application. Hence you do not need to have a copy of the trust with you. Further, the Form 1/4 is a tax document so it gets special status on who gets to see it.

Further again, the trust is an estate planning document and there is no reason why local PD, or the ATF, needs to see that upon request. Last further, you want something that ties you to the trust unless the name if the trust is "Firstname Lastname Trust". In my opinion, if it ever gets that far you will not be in a ATF at the range situation - so they can wait for my lawyer to get them a copy of the docs that ties me to the trust.

All that said, I carry a scanned copy of each of my forms on a USB drive on my keychain. Legally, that suffices, until I go to court and a judge says otherwise. Again, if it ever gets to that there is an overwhelming likelihood that my lawyer would already be involved. The nicest I have seen is a reduced size scan/print-out of the document(s) (say 3x5 sized), laminated with a whole punched in them, and carried on a carabiner attached to a range bag. Looks cool, but no one needs to see my business.