How many of you guys are at home

[Martinjmpr]

You know, I hear this over and over and over with regard to the teacher pay issue and it really rubs me the wrong way:

Many teachers have to pay for their own supplies for their classes.

Let's state that correctly: Many teachers CHOOSE to pay for supplies for their own classes.

It may seem like a quibble but it's not. Nobody is forcing teachers to pay out of their own pockets for school supplies and yet on the news you hear this refrain again and again and again ad nauseum.

I want to see one example - just one, bonafide, verified example - of a teacher who was fired, fined, disciplined or otherwise punished because he/she refused to pay out of his/her own pocket for school supplies. That would not only be a violation of the employment contract but it would most likely violate state law as well.

Now, if teachers CHOOSE to spend their own money on certain things because they don't like the ones that are provided by the schools that's their choice, isn't it? And if they feel like they can't afford it then what is stopping them from telling the parents of those students that they, the parents, should be the ones contributing (because really, it's their kids, they ought to be the ones paying for their kids education, shouldn't they?)

And if the response to that is "well, in poor parts of town parent's can't afford to contribute to the school" - well, if that's true then how are they going to be able to afford the higher taxes that will be needed to increase teacher salaries? The money's got to come from somewhere.

[colorider]

It s not really school supplies. It's classroom decorations they have to pay for. The alphabet letters above the chalkboard, the neat cartoonish stuff on the walls, the fun cutouts on the door. That stuff is out of pocket. And also a dollar at the dollar store.

[CoGirl303]

You know, I hear this over and over and over with regard to the teacher pay issue and it really rubs me the wrong way:



Let's state that correctly: Many teachers CHOOSE to pay for supplies for their own classes.

It may seem like a quibble but it's not. Nobody is forcing teachers to pay out of their own pockets for school supplies and yet on the news you hear this refrain again and again and again ad nauseum.

I want to see one example - just one, bonafide, verified example - of a teacher who was fired, fined, disciplined or otherwise punished because he/she refused to pay out of his/her own pocket for school supplies. That would not only be a violation of the employment contract but it would most likely violate state law as well.

Now, if teachers CHOOSE to spend their own money on certain things because they don't like the ones that are provided by the schools that's their choice, isn't it? And if they feel like they can't afford it then what is stopping them from telling the parents of those students that they, the parents, should be the ones contributing (because really, it's their kids, they ought to be the ones paying for their kids education, shouldn't they?)

And if the response to that is "well, in poor parts of town parent's can't afford to contribute to the school" - well, if that's true then how are they going to be able to afford the higher taxes that will be needed to increase teacher salaries? The money's got to come from somewhere.

maybe they're buying their own supplies because the state issued supplies are inadequate?


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[Jeffrey Lebowski]

One other thing I forgot to mention. Economics.

There are more people coming to Colorado, thus it is safe to assume that there are more teachers included in the migration. Simple economics states that the more supply you have the lower the pricing goes, just like in my chosen field there are probably more teachers for the district to choose from so the salary will remain low until the demand is met, when the demand goes up then the price will go up providing the supply remains the same or diminishes.

By that argument, demand would increase too. More people coming includes teachers and students.

[hollohas]

Darn near every school has a required material list that students must provide at the beginning of each year. If they need more supplies, ask the parents to provide them.

And I always hear from teachers that they feel like parents expect them to raise their kids. And I believe that to be true very often. But what I also hear a lot is teachers bitching about parents who constantly bug them. Which is it? Do they want the parents involved or not??? You can't ask for more parent involvement and then accuse parents of being pests when they do get involved.

[Martinjmpr]

maybe they're buying their own supplies because the state issued supplies are inadequate?

The reason doesn't matter. What I take exception to is this ridiculous claim that teachers "HAVE TO" buy supplies.

No, they don't HAVE TO. They CHOOSE to.

The reason why they choose to doesn't matter.

Because it's still their choice.

If the teacher can't buy classroom decorations or stars to put by the student's names because she has to pay her rent, that's OK in my book.

My guess is that the children will not grow up to be homeless sociopaths because they were deprived of little "GREAT JOB!" stickers on their homework.

(Side note: I had a professor in an English class who used to do that to our papers. In COLLEGE! )

[OneGuy67]

correct me if I'm wrong but are the teachers not part of a teacher's union? If the public employees are part of a union, then they have the right to strike. If not, then they dont...unless they vote to form a union.

I'm probably going off the ads and some of what politicians were selling in regards to mj money going towards education, but still a lot more than $90 million should be going towards education.

The National Education Association (NEA) is the national union that has organized all the protests across the nation that are capturing the media's attention. Not all teachers are part of their local union, but most are. There are unions for police (FOP, etc.) at the local, state and national level, and there are unions for the fire personnel (IAFF) as well. Do you support them walking off the job to protest? BTW, its illegal for them to do so in Colorado. I am part of a union I guess in my occupation, but there are no collective bargaining rights, just legal protection.

maybe they're buying their own supplies because the state issued supplies are inadequate?

The State doesn't provide supplies. What part of local control, e.g. local school boards isn''t registering? That is the crux of many people's argument to their idiotic walkout to the capital; the legislatures do not control their salary, their school districts decisions into how to spend per pupil funding each district does get from the state or their working environment.

If the teachers want to get the local voters on board for a Mil Levy Override (MLO) like Douglas County wants, or support your desire for additional funding for school districts (e.g. possible pay raises for you) you don't walk out of a school day and leave the students and parents hanging. Their is an expectation that the teacher will be in the classroom and teaching the children during the time period expected and if the teacher isn't there, then the parent or parents have to find childcare or take a day off to be with their child(ren).

[Irving]

Shit, I've been buying my own business supplies this whole time. I should unionize.

[RblDiver]

*short rant* One thing I think absolutely needs to be addressed asap is switching pensions from defined benefit to defined contribution (for all public employees, not just teachers). That will begin the process of stopping a lot of the bleeding. *end short rant*

[OneGuy67]

*short rant* One thing I think absolutely needs to be addressed asap is switching pensions from defined benefit to defined contribution (for all public employees, not just teachers). That will begin the process of stopping a lot of the bleeding. *end short rant*

I agree.