Shooting at a Synagogue in Pittsburgh

[roberth]

It's hard to accept that life sucks and there's no valid reason justification or explanation for it. A lot of people struggle with that fundamental matter, in different ways.

I think this is the biggest problem with many, many people.

Life really sucks if a person doesn't take responsibility for their own actions.

Change comes from within.

[Justin]

Only a fraction of a fraction leak to the media.

What kind of percentage do you want to bet don't follow the box a TSC proscribes?

What percentage tells things to a spouse?
A parent?
A sibling?
A close friend?

All those are prohibited. Even if disclosures are considered less important/unimportant by the person with the clearance. Suffice to say, people are not as tight lipped about things today as they used to be. I'd venture a guess more than 50% of people with a TSC have shared things protected by that TSC with a spouse.

So no, it's not "fundamentally untrue" it's just not the whole picture. (And I don't doubt you deny this as well, but I don't expect people with a TSC to be objective in admitting anything...)

So, on the one hand, we have all of the people who've gone through the process of being vetted for a clearance, and who presumably take seriously that they're entrusted with knowledge that, if it were to get out, could cost them their livlihood, reputation, and freedom, as well as the national security stance of the USA and lives of fellow Americans, and on the other hand you have a general, but unverifiable belief that everyone talks because you once read a listicle on IFL Science or something, that stated that secrets can't be contained by a group if it has more than five people.

The fact that plenty of companies manage to keep proprietary information under wraps, defense contractors, government, and military keep classified information from leaking would tend to show that, indeed, large groups of people can, and do, regularly keep secrets. One would tend to expect that the higher the stakes in any given situation, the more likely they would be to keep their mouth shut.

[Aloha_Shooter]

Outside of a small group of say, five people, a conspiracy of any kind becomes virtually impossible thanks to the modern American. People with TSC's can't even keep secrets anymore, yet people think hundreds of ANTIFA foaming liberals can?

I will agree with you in so far as I don't believe in large conspiracies but that's a different from protecting classified information and your charge that people with TSCs can't keep secrets is just false. It's true that a small number of visible glory-seekers have betrayed their oaths and done large amounts of grave damage to national security but you paint with far-too-wide a brush (or roller).

This is fundamentally untrue, at least for the 1 million+ contractors, government, and military people whose daily work requires them to handle classified data.

The only people who seem to get away with leaking classified information and suffering no repurcussions are the the ones who get top cover from the entities that should be responsible for prosecuting and punishing such transgressions.

Agreed.

Only a fraction of a fraction leak to the media.

What kind of percentage do you want to bet don't follow the box a TSC proscribes?

What percentage tells things to a spouse?
A parent?
A sibling?
A close friend?

All those are prohibited. Even if disclosures are considered less important/unimportant by the person with the clearance. Suffice to say, people are not as tight lipped about things today as they used to be. I'd venture a guess more than 50% of people with a TSC have shared things protected by that TSC with a spouse.

I'd say your guess is grossly incorrect and fundamentally untrue as Justin said but then I don't expect people with an axe to bear to be objective in assessing anything either ...

[roberth]

I'd say life generally sucks for just about everybody, for a good portion of their life, (some for their entire life), some far, far worse than others, and taking responsibility for ones own actions usually may have little to do with it. Where and whom you were born to can matter an impressive amount. Genetics matter even more. This is the dilemma that people have to deal with and clashes with fundamental ingrained beliefs about government and religion, and it's about as shocking to the psyche as anything can be.

e.g.
If your sibling gets in a car crash and is on life support, you may fall into religion to "fix" your sibling. Yet, they perish anyway after months in a coma.
If you get terminal cancer in your early twenties, you may fall into trusting religion to cure you and let you continue life, and at the end of your life, you still have the same terminal cancer.
If you get raped, you may fall into trusting the gov't to respond and catch the perpetrator. Yet, it gets twisted around and morphs into a grotesque monster in the legal system.
Someone sues you frivolously, you may fall into trusting the legal system to do it's job and throw it out promptly. Yet, it is another grotesque monster in the legal system and you lose all your assets (to attorneys, or judgement, or whatever)..
Someone burglarizes your home and burns it down, you may fall into trusting the system to restore you (insurance) and the gov't to catch them (justice) yet both fail you and you are virtually homeless for a couple years.
You develop a critical genetic disease. Whelp, not your fault. You might trust something to develop medicine or a cure, but when it doesn't happen...

These are just a few examples.

Personal responsibility doesn't really enter into these equations - it does others. But it's these that entrap "normal" "healthy" people into the hard psychological question that is easiest answered by falling upon "EVERYTHING IS A CONSPIRACY" mind-think. Or any alternative explanation (it's their own fault) or ancient explanations (they are cursed, they sinned, etc.)

The alternative is worse:
1) People you love are going to die and you have no control over it.
2) You're going to die and you have no control over it.
3) You live within a broken political, legal, and government system, which will do nothing it promised for you when you need it most.
4) Life's not fair, no, but - really.
5) Existence may be inconsequential.

Certainly, there are people that don't take personal responsibility in life that breed deeper problems; but the majority of the worst suckage of life oft cannot legitimately be blamed on anything at all, and psychology seems to need something to blame or explain it away.

I was thinking on the small scale, you're in the macro and you're right.

[Skip]

There are plenty of accounts and books and whatever of people that have gotten sucked in White Supremacist groups.

[snip]

[Irving]

Lol, whoops. Auto correct is killing me today. I'm need to log off for a while, my posting has even been annoying me lately.

[Skip]

Lol, whoops. Auto correct is killing me today. I'm need to log off for a while, my posting has even been annoying me lately.

It was funny man, I lol'd.

And it was needed levity.

[Gman]

If they happened as often as shootings in the leftist bastion of Chicago, maybe everyone would ignore them.

Just checked the Chicago stats for October: 43 shot and killed, 195 shot and wounded.