Hard flooring options

[Irving]

But having a subfloor isn't an issue for kitchens, laundry, and bathrooms.

I think there are certain crack isolation membranes that help with that.

https://www.custombuildingproducts.c...-membrane.aspx

[FoxtArt]

I've put in a butt-ton of tile in my life. Currently in a whole-house wood look tile that I installed. If you install it right, it isn't ever breaking on tile or grout lines. Even if your shit settles by 6" on each side.

Ceramic actually flexes quite a bit before it breaks. Each wood-look tile can tolerate at least 3-5mm of flex before cracking. That's an inch every 10 feet, or so. Now, if you have drastic settling, the whole tile floor will crack as if it is concrete - in a lateral line going through the tiles, it doesn't matter where the edges or grout are.

Tile has two IMPORTANT factors:

1) Above all else, the tiles - especially the lengthy wood look ones - MUST BE BACKBUTTERED. RULE #1. You can lay out a grid of say, 4x2 tiles, spray them down with a spraybottle (always prewet surfaces), quickly spread your thinset over the block, then go to your surface, quickly spray it down, quickly set your thinset down (all lines should be parallel, swirls are from idiot installers) and slap your tiles in. You can lay pretty fast this way, but this is done RIGHT. I recommend using the cheapest thinset ($8/bag) mixed with the normal liquid ratio but comprised of 50% water and 50% latex admix ($28.00/2.5 gallons). This is very strong but also very cost effective.

2) When you install this way, you can drop a sledgehammer on the tile and it won't crack. (It'll just dent a bit). You can intentionally hit the tiles about a dozen or two dozen times with a claw hammer and they won't crack. You can neglect to install grout for years and they won't go anywhere. How do I know this personally? Well, let's just say don't install all your tile and then decide you want to upgrade to HVAC.

3) If you don't backbutter, many of the tiles will start to sound a little hollow when you walk on them, and over time the impacts will pulverise the thinset into dust and it'll come off. Also, if you drop anything on it, it will crack.

4) RULE #2: ALWAYS BUY AND STORE QUITE A BIT EXTRA (15% overpurchase SF). Tile lasts a looooooong ass time. Because it's not an interlocking design, lets say your floor settles 5" and you get a lateral crack running across a room. Well, fix it. Tile varieties don't stay in stores very long - months, at most, so you'll never be able to buy it when you need it, and they go out permanently. Manufacturers don't do "throwbacks".

Advantages: Sheer longevity and bullet-proof. Yet, readily repairable, if you don't mind pulverizing ceramic with a hammer until progressively pissed off). Fireproof. Pet proof. Renter proof. Crazy ex girlfriend proof. Bug proof. Shit proof. Immune to HIV. Makes you better at BBQ'ing. Makes you want a pool. Makes you want pool parties. Makes you install a pool. Makes you post fliers for pool parties.

Disadvantages: Young kids falling on tile isn't ideal, may as well be concrete. Even laminate has a ever-so-slight give. For the same reason, slightly harder on your feet. I've never noticed cold being much of an issue tbh, but that's me. (I actually prefer it, e.g. summer time). Also only two hairy old guys show up to your pool party, not any of the nice women you had in mind.


That said, the newer PVC flooring would be a lot easier to install.

ETA: Most/many tile installers horribly f$#$ installs up. Even if you are paying someone to install, you REALLY need to know the correct way so you can fire the idiots. People are happy hiring them because hey, even a crap job of tile will last a year ... more than long enough to write a review and pay a guy. If an installer tries to tell you that "swirls" in thinset are right, or that you don't need backbutter, you need to terminate ASAP. And these guys go on installing it incorrectly for sometimes 30+ years. Don't just expect "old" to mean "right".

[brutal]

Hardwood finishes, while not immune from damage (hard object drops) are extremely durable. We have the Bono finish on our new 3.5" Red Oak floors and it's damn tough. As I understand it, tile damage is a bitch to have repaired as compared to hardwood.

[FoxtArt]

Eh, I've installed hardwood (tongue and groove) and I don't know any other way to repair damage than to pull it all back from the wall. Maybe better installers have a trick, but since they interlock you either have to rip out the structure that holds it together or uninstall the whole floor to get back to the damaged area. I consider that to be a bitch. Tile, you can use anything but an impact drill to cut out just the one piece. Vibtraroty cutters, cutoff wheels on grout, diamond tipped hole saws, diamond edged saws-all (with a pilot) etc. Once you're through to the concrete board you can generally get it to pry up the rest of it pretty well, then just scrape the thinset, mix a small batch of thinset in a paper cup, and reinstall.

I also do grout in very small batches (paper cup) so tbh, fixing damage isn't much more time over the install, save for breaking the f'n tile off. Cutting is a win, pulverizing until a crack develops can work too but it sucks on well installed. (impact drills imo cause premature wear on the surrounding adhesion)

[Irving]

The thing to remember with refinishing hardwood, is that you don't just refinish a small area, you refinish ALL uninterrupted floors. So the difference between replacing a cracked tile and refinishing your entire ground floor is likely substantial. If the sanders don't do a good job, you'll be painting base trim as well.

[CS1983]

Right now we are leaning toward some LVT/EVP stuff.

We like this one:
https://www.lumberliquidators.com/ll...VPBK7/10043228

Have a sample of that and a sample of the Brazilian cherry that we got today. Plan to do some scratch and dent tests. They are both 28mil wear layer.

[Mtneer]

The thing to remember with refinishing hardwood, is that you don't just refinish a small area, you refinish ALL uninterrupted floors. So the difference between replacing a cracked tile and refinishing your entire ground floor is likely substantial. If the sanders don't do a good job, you'll be painting base trim as well.

Truth! We were evaced for 6 days due to wildfire. Power was out so the icemaker in the fridge melted, ruining a 6 square foot section of oak flooring. Since it's all connected, and covered by insurance, they refinished about 900 sq ft. We had to evac for another couple days during the sanding and varnishing. Looks and feels great, likely will last another 25 years or more. But I'd consider a modern option if we ever have to rebuild.

[Wulf202]

I've installed a truck load or two of Armstrong lvp. It's fairly tolerant of scratches even in a rental use

[def90]

I'm not sold on the benefit of sanding/refinishing for hardwood. Given that would mean what is essentially moving out of the house for the duration of the project, and I'm sure it's not cheap, I almost wonder if it's only a benefit for those with money to burn vs just replacing a floor in 10 years (and I imagine in 10 years the improvements of non-hardwood will be in place).

? Just move the furniture in to another room for the day, no different than shampooing carpets. The process of sanding is pretty much dustless and the finish dries in about 24 hours. Then move furniture to the next room and so on.

[CS1983]

at the cost of an entirely new non-hardwood floor, though?