Gonna be a mess - got an excuse to agitate

[Great-Kazoo]

I seriously doubt he'd say that if "protesters" were standing outside his house with bricks and Molotov cocktails.

Guv Cuomo issued a stand down order State wide in NY to all LE depts on (iirc) thursday. I agree lets get a protest going in front of their homes and see the results.

[Bailey Guns]

^^ You could be right about that.

[BlasterBob]

Well, I am exactly ten years OLDER that the old fart, who may possibly have tripped over his own feet after that push/shove, but if I saw a squad of cops heading towards me to clear the area, I still have enough common sense remaining, to make a quick 180 degree (U-Turn) and get out the hell out of their way. You poke the bear and he may just make you wish you hadn’t messed with him........

[MrPrena]

I understand some 75+ can throw 85mph fastball, and hit 90mph change up. I am sure pete rose can at age 79.

Whereas some of 75 takes 3 seconds after green light to roll forward at 15mph slower than a speed limit.
Perhaps that guy who got shoved needed about 3+ seconds what the hell is happening and act on it.


Queens guard version

[GilpinGuy]

BG, did you feel that there was a culture of "don't tell on one of your own"? I don't know, but he asshat that killed Floyd had something like 17 complaints filed against him in 20 years. You had 1, it sounds like. But no other officer noticed anything wrong with this guy?

Like I wrote, it just "seems" like cops aught to protect themselves by calling out the shitheads and getting them out.

I'm sure it's worse in serioisly urban areas like Chicago or NYC, so maybe you haven't experienced it as much. But the perception of cops covering for each other when bad shit happens is no bueno.

[Gman]

BG, did you feel that there was a culture of "don't tell on one of your own"? I don't know, but he asshat that killed Floyd had something like 17 complaints filed against him in 20 years. You had 1, it sounds like. But no other officer noticed anything wrong with this guy?

Like I wrote, it just "seems" like cops aught to protect themselves by calling out the shitheads and getting them out.

I'm sure it's worse in serioisly urban areas like Chicago or NYC, so maybe you haven't experienced it as much. But the perception of cops covering for each other when bad shit happens is no bueno.

I seem to recall bad cops in MN had the attention of the prosecutor, Presidential candidate Amy Klobuchar, and she didn't do anything about it. She deferred to grand juries. Then you have police unions protecting bad officers. So, maybe it's not just the officers protecting themselves?

[Bailey Guns]

BG, did you feel that there was a culture of "don't tell on one of your own"? I don't know, but he asshat that killed Floyd had something like 17 complaints filed against him in 20 years. You had 1, it sounds like. But no other officer noticed anything wrong with this guy?

Like I wrote, it just "seems" like cops aught to protect themselves by calling out the shitheads and getting them out.

I'm sure it's worse in serioisly urban areas like Chicago or NYC, so maybe you haven't experienced it as much. But the perception of cops covering for each other when bad shit happens is no bueno.

Maybe a little of that culture. But then again, I don't recall anything seriously bad happening that would've warranted that. I worked with guys that got fired for doing illegal stuff...mostly related to drugs...off duty. I recall at least two the got fired who killed themselves afterward. One at the sheriff's dept...young kid had a problem with liking little kids. Got investigated, arrested, booked, posted bond, got released, went home and hung himself. Another at the PD was ordering something by mail from an Asian country...don't recall what. I think it was something to help with stress/nerves/anxiety. He'd gone thru a divorce and was having a hard time with it. Got warned by ATF to stop and he didn't listen. Then got arrested the next time. Of course he'd been suspended once the investigation started. Once he posted bond and got out of jail he shot himself. There was no indication with either of those guys at work they were doing this shit. At least not with me.

And Cstone is right about complaints. I had several over the years. Most were pretty trivial and didn't amount to anything except a pissed off citizen that was venting because I didn't use a turn signal or something like that. A few were serious enough to get me involved in a formal investigation. It's pretty sobering to have to listen to a Garrity advisement in the internal affairs dept (similar to a Miranda advisement only you're not in custody or don't have to be in custody). I was sued several times...but only the one time that really went anywhere because most of the time it's bullshit. Oftentimes you don't even know you've been the subject of a lawsuit.

Same thing with "use of force" reports against an officer. It would probably sound pretty bad if I told you I had 15 (just an example) "use of force" reports in my file for one year. What you probably wouldn't know is a "use of force" can be as simple as firing your gun to euthanize an animal that had been struck by a car (that happened about once a month on average at the sheriff's dept with me because I worked in a mountain district). Other times it would include having to pepper spray someone to take them into custody...something like that. It varies from dept to dept. The point is, just because someone has several complaints and/or use of force reports filed on them doesn't necessarily equate to being a heavy handed, bad cop.

I never worked for a dept that had a union...well, one that was like they are back east, anyway. We had a union at the PD but it was pretty much just to negotiate with the city for pay and benefits. It was also a good excuse to have a Christmas party every year.

This is part of the problem. People think they understand police work but they really don't. Cstone is right again talking about the guys that just develop the "I don't care anymore" attitude. I recall a few of those guys. I avoided them like the plague.

[hollohas]

Same thing with "use of force" reports against an officer. It would probably sound pretty bad if I told you I had 15 (just an example) "use of force" reports in my file for one year. What you probably wouldn't know is a "use of force" can be as simple as firing your gun to euthanize an animal that had been struck by a car (that happened about once a month on average at the sheriff's dept with me because I worked in a mountain district). Other times it would include having to pepper spray someone to take them into custody...something like that.

Yeah, "use of force" is pretty low bar these days. A LEO friend of mine had a situation recently in which the individual he needed to arrest was sitting in a chair at the hospital (person needed to be checked by a doctor before going to jail). He told the individual it was time to go and asked the individual to stand up. The individual refused after multiple requests. So, the officer simply picked the individual up to stand them on their feet. No fight. No struggling. No less lethal. No different than picking up a child who refuses to move. And he was required to file a use-of-force report. He actually gave the suspect many chances to stand on their own specifically because he was trying to avoid the paperwork.

[Irving]

I know some cops and the stories they tell, and defend, of "just doing their job!", wouldn't fly here at all.

[MrPrena]

I know some cops and the stories they tell, and defend, of "just doing their job!", wouldn't fly here at all.

Another good excuse. "I was just following order from _________."

Reminds me of Few Good Men.