Texas Challenge

[FoxtArt]

Not only that, but I haven't been impressed with what they've brought to court. Rudy Giuliani and the epitome of Bimbo?

If you want to reset an election, you need a bit more than side shows at Barnum and Bailey. If you can only convince 25% of the country, that's not because the other 75% doesn't care, it's because your showing isn't very strong.

The other factor is this is TRUMP. If a different GOP president made these claims and had reasonable support, people would take it seriously.

But we have a president that has spent his campaign being a complete and utter buffoon on twitter. Insulting people, spreading his own conspiracies on occasion. Making baseless insinuations, we all know the drill, and we've all ignored it. But it's a bit like the story of "boy that cried wolf" especially since he was crying fraud before any alleged fraud every occurred.

It's hard for people to back an utter idiot and his actions greatly amplify horrible results if we did. If Rand Paul, Ted Cruz, Ted Gowdy, any of those people - if they were president and alleged election fraud and had some decent evidence (and were not using Barnum and Bailey) I think you would find tremendous support for investigation and/or correction.

But Trump? Thing is, everyone already knew he would allege fraud in any event, in any circumstance, in any situation except where he won. And he didn't fail on those expectations. Because of that, I guess you could say the burden of evidence is much, much much higher for most of the country. And SCOTUS isn't any presidents bitch, even if he did appoint them. If they heard Texas, what's to stop a liberal court from hearing California and New York next time? SCOTUS Justices in general DO NOT interfere in elections. You've got to have substantial evidence, not just allegations, not just a few cases of individuals conducting fraud.

That's not to say it doesn't exist, or there isn't an issue, it's just the reality on the ground. It's kind of like the crackhead that just robbed 7/11 screaming about police brutality. Maybe it's real, maybe it's not, but bystanders really don't give a shit.

[Irving]

That's pretty much the way I see it, but we're filthy never Trumpers and I want to hear from someone else as well.

[MrPrena]

Many believes that if GOP does this to teach Democrats about "oh, i guess we were wrong about Russian meddlin" from this is dreaming. Democrats do not think this way.
As some members stated, after this election, republican being a president might be a harder path to achieve. (Unless there is a superstar who can lure moderate, unaffiliated to vote republican).

[wctriumph]

As law abiding citizens, when laws are passed that go against our interpretation of the constitution, because we believe in the constitution and the rule of law, do we follow those new laws?
You know, the laws that say get in line to turn in your “assault rifles” and ammunition for same? Will you register your firearms like a good law abiding citizen?

You don’t need to answer, use it or lose it ...

Judicial cowardice has been allowed, encouraged even, for the destruction of the republic.

[WETWRKS]

As law abiding citizens, when laws are passed that go against our interpretation of the constitution, because we believe in the constitution and the rule of law, do we follow those new laws?
You know, the laws that say get in line to turn in your “assault rifles” and ammunition for same? Will you register your firearms like a good law abiding citizen?

You don’t need to answer, use it or lose it ...

Judicial cowardice has been allowed, encouraged even, for the destruction of the republic.

It seems that line was drawn in the sand with the bumpstock ban. Out of about 500k in existence it sounds like a few thousand were turned in.

[Irving]

Not really. All people had to do was nothing at all, which is the baseline for most of the country when it comes to being politically active. If a couple thousand were turned in, and there were 495k lawsuits in progress, then we could say a line had been drawn in the sand.

[FoxtArt]

I don't think there is a precedence for successful turnover of anything (for free, no less) here. And I don't think it has much to do with any political protest. It's more to do with "it's already mine". E.g. when prohibition started I'm sure private owners of alcohol were rushing to dump all their private alcohol out. The only reason certain things were successfully removed is because they actually rounded up the purchases from the purchasers (atkins accelerator, right? Or was it...I forget)

[Aloha_Shooter]

The Democrats started preparing for this as soon as they (or some of them) accepted that they lost in 2016. The schemes to manufacture votes were already present in the 2018 election and they ramped it up when they saw he was pulling in black and Latino votes. No one -- not even Fox News -- has pointed out that Trump also got more votes than Obama did in 2008, the year Obama was being presented as some kind of post-racial "moderate" savior. The Democrats inoculated against the charges of fraud by starting the whisper campaigns about him alleging fraud and having to literally be pulled out of the White House without a shred of evidence. It's much the way Hillary inoculated herself immediately after 9/11 by loudly proclaiming no one could accuse her of being unpatriotic before anyone did so. Once inoculated in the public mind, she then proceeded to undermine Bush at every turn.

The same thing is happening here. The media and courts are actively ignoring documented evidence of widespread irregularities and outright fraud on a scale never seen before in a national election. Democratic officials changing rules and procedures to make it easier to vote fraudulently by mail despite not having any statutory or constitutional power to do so in their states? This is just to handle the pandemic. Oh yeah, it's common to store ballots out of sight underneath a table and only pull them out for processing AFTER all observers have been kicked out of the room. 100,000 votes processed overnight in one county after everyone had been told processing had been shut down? Oh yeah, that's normal. We expected that, no, no surprises about every single one of them being for a single candidate. Papering over the windows of the pivotal election center in Philadelphia? Oh yeah, that was to protect voter privacy. Nothing to see here, move along.

I have never liked "The Donald" personally and his team has been disjointed (and a number of them had turned on him before the election which says a lot about him personally) but the allegations of fraud are FAR from baseless. They've presented all sorts of testimonials and video evidence while the "explanations" for the irregularities have been presented without evidence. People -- and the courts -- have latched on to them as an excuse to ignore or even ridicule the complaints simply because they don't like him (and the MSM has spent the last 5 years making sure more people dislike him even more by distorting things he's said or tweeted). When that hasn't been enough, they've just made things up out of thin air.

Having said all that, I think the Dems and Never Trumpers did what they did under the assumption that people who voted for Trump will not want to go through an actual civil war over this election. I would agree -- there's clearly a large portion of the country that detests him to the point of being willing to accept the racist, violent, anti-Western, anti-capitalist movement that goes with Biden/Harris. Civil wars are nasty things.

What I want however is for the courts and system to be honest enough to admit that the irregularities and signs of fraud were so widespread and so blatant that a blind man could see them and that some people need to go to jail or at least lose their jobs over the shenanigans. Anyone involved in illegitimately preventing election judges or poll watchers from seeing fair processing of ballots in Philadelphia and Fulton County should be permanently barred from being involved in the election process. Anyone who directed late ballots be predated for processing should be fired.

I don't have any faith that Biden/Harris would take those measures or pursue an investigation but we need it.

[Irving]

Whole heartedly agree that people found to have tried to influence the election at the polls should be severely punished.

[MED]

I read through this thread, and some of it I found rather disheartening on this site. As I?ve said before this is not about Trump, we are at a crisis point in our constitutional republic. I believe people should be extremely concerned about the first amendment violations happening right now. The suppression of opposition is insane. Whether it is social media censoring posts, hosting companies being threatened with circuit removal if they don?t bring down certain websites, scientists who are blackballed for opposing findings of politically protected ?research?, or the thugs who threaten and assault people who dare to speak out. The ?fact checking? thing is ridiculous especially when you look at those doing the ?fact checking.? Under the first amendment people have the right to speak their beliefs regardless if they are accurate or what anybody else thinks about them; and this right should be protected by the government not attacked. This is all gestapo tactics to force people in line. I don?t trust anything or anyone that suppresses opposition; this is and always has been a key indicator of tyranny. This past year (actually several years) we?ve seen an assault on historical artifacts, monuments, American culture, people of faith, people stepping forward in this election, and legal attacks on political opponents. We?ve seen people harassed along with kids being bullied and harassed in school who?s families support the president. The fact that all of this is happening right in front of us should be a massive red flag that there is something seriously wrong with our country.

This election is no different. The narrative pushed by the media (propaganda machine) that there is no evidence is ridiculous. There?s approximately a thousand eye witness to crimes who signed sworn affidavits. These violations of state and federal laws are well known and factual. One eye witness to a murder will certainly initiate an investigation, law enforcement collects evidence, and likely a conviction if the evidence corroborates the testimony. Yet, the Department of Justice won?t interview hundreds of people who came forward, law enforcement won?t collect the voting machines and ballots to do a full audit and forensic analysis. It is not the job nor the ability of the legal teams to collect physical evidence so people need to stop dismissing them for not having it; that is the job of law enforcement, and they are not doing it. The county in MI had an independent team come in and do a full forensic analysis on the voting machine ?glitch? too big to hide...the error rate is astonishing. Numerous precincts had return rates that exceeded !00%. PA sent out approximately 600,000 less ballots than they received. There is plenty of testimony and election law violations to start an investigation in each of these contested states. All the physical evidence (machines and ballots) should have been taken into custody immediately after the election was contested. Seriously, the Clinton campaign paid somebody to fabricate a document, which was used to obtain illegal FISA warrants that initiated millions of dollars investigating a hoax, but all these sworn witness are dismissed without even hearing them? How can anybody that isn?t an extreme partisan not see a problem with that double standard? Regardless of the illegal ballot count, Republican observers were not allowed to do their job in the contested precincts, which invalidates their results. This is 100% suppression. Do we live in the United States or communist China? If at this point you think you are protected by the constitution, you?re delusional. We will not just move forward like nothing happened. If this election and the suppression of opposition is allowed we will live a tightly controlled life. Our children and grand children will know what it means to live in tyranny.

As far as Trump. If he was a bad candidate, he wouldn?t have received more re-election votes than any other president not to mention that total was manipulated by the games being played and the media vilifying him with every word. However, this isn?t about Trump, and everybody should see that. If this election is allowed to stand, it is the end of the republic as we know it, and you will live in tyranny?fall in line or be attacked?that should be obvious to anybody by now.

For those thinking this is over The last stand is a 14th typo 12th amendment challenge if the Rs in Congress have the balls to do it. For me it isn?t just about Trump so I don?t like that it has come to this; I want the truth. I wanted a real investigation to PROVE what happened, and those who violated election laws held accountable. The suppression tactics need to be stopped; that is the core of what is happening here and people really need to contemplate what that means for our future.