Another Road Rage Turned Deadly

[Squeeze]

Sounds like a good shoot. I have been the victim of a "hit & run" before while riding my motorcycle. I completely understand wanting to get the suspect's vehicle make/model/license plate and report it to police, which appears to be what the motorcyclist was trying to do. That woman escalated it and it cost her 2 lives. I know we joke about Florida being the land of the crazy, but this is just plain stupidity.

Pregnant Florida woman Sara Morales shot dead by motorcyclist she hit with her car (nypost.com)

[Aloha_Shooter]

There's so little information in that article that I don't know how you can say it sounds like a good shoot. The article says she intentionally hit him while making a turn but the reporter doesn't profess to any telepathic powers that would allow him/her to establish intent. We also don't know from this article whether the motorcyclist behaved in anyway that might provoke a response. I've seen good and bad motorcyclists all over the country -- the bad ones engaging in all kinds of obnoxious behavior. It's one thing to get her address and the vehicle information, it's a whole other thing to stay there by her home. Hell, he could have waited for the police up the block from the house.

This may indeed have been a good shoot -- my point is just that this article isn't enough to establish that and as with many cases (like the Aurora shooting) there well could have been assholery on both sides.

[Grant H.]

There's so little information in that article that I don't know how you can say it sounds like a good shoot. The article says she intentionally hit him while making a turn but the reporter doesn't profess to any telepathic powers that would allow him/her to establish intent. We also don't know from this article whether the motorcyclist behaved in anyway that might provoke a response. I've seen good and bad motorcyclists all over the country -- the bad ones engaging in all kinds of obnoxious behavior. It's one thing to get her address and the vehicle information, it's a whole other thing to stay there by her home. Hell, he could have waited for the police up the block from the house.

This may indeed have been a good shoot -- my point is just that this article isn't enough to establish that and as with many cases (like the Aurora shooting) there well could have been assholery on both sides.

30 seconds on google shows a lot more detail than this hatchet job of a article.

[Aloha_Shooter]

30 seconds on google shows a lot more detail than this hatchet job of a article.

I didn't see a LOT more detail -- bodycam footage AFTER the shooting with the motorcyclist saying she pulled her gun first and the Orange City PD saying she instigated the incident -- but OP only cited the NY Post article. The major factor in his favor that I've seen is that investigators said she was the aggressor. That's likely based on the testimony of the other witnesses who also said she hit him intentionally and that fact she confronted him in the street, not her yard. Another factor in his favor is the CWP -- my general experience is that people who take the trouble to get a CWP are usually calmer and more level-headed about use of their weapons.

Who are those other witnesses who took time to follow her, try to stop her, etc.? My initial guess is that they were fellow bikers. They may have been telling the truth or just supporting their buddy.

I still didn't see any information on what might have provoked her into hitting him intentionally (assuming she did) but let's be honest, a woman who is 4-5 months pregnant has a lot of different hormones flowing which may or may not have affected her judgment and actions. She very well could have behaved exactly as described with no rational basis -- I'm just not seeing any evidence yet either way beyond the statement of the biker and unidentified witnesses and she's not around to give her side of the story.

[Grant H.]

I disagree on the "good shoot" comment... The "motorcyclist" was doing a LOT more than trying to get make/model/plate...

We don't know what instigated this, but I have serious doubts that a pregnant librarian hit a motorcyclist unprovoked. Now that she's dead, we'll never know what actually instigated the whole thing.

I'm tired of this "everything is attempted murder" attitude from motorcyclists who ride like a$$holes. There is ALWAYS a common denominator with these 2-wheeled 'tards... Their own arrogance and stupidity... I ride a LOT and I have zero respect for those who are always the "victim" while on 2 wheels...

To then follow her, try to force her to stop, and then continue to follow her to her house, and onto her property is WAY beyond the authority that this a$$h@t holds.

Write down, or take a picture of the plate and car.
Call the cops.
Get witness contact info.

Don't follow. Don't escalate.

Personally, I hope this "SOA wanna-be POS" never sleeps well again. He killed a pregnant woman AND an unborn child over a f*cking fender bender...

[Martinjmpr]

I'm tired of this "everything is attempted murder" attitude from motorcyclists who ride like a$$holes. There is ALWAYS a common denominator with these 2-wheeled 'tards... Their own arrogance and stupidity... I ride a LOT and I have zero respect for those who are always the "victim" while on 2 wheels...

Preach it, Brother. I'm another long-time rider (39 years) who has no patience with motorcyclists who act like assholes on the grounds that "cage drivers are out to kill us!"

My thought is: If you're that scared of car drivers, stay off the road.

Funny thing, within the past 5 days I had two incidents where people who should have seen me pulled right into my lane of traffic nearly causing an accident. Both incidents happened during the daylight.

In one of them I was driving my wife's Honda CR-V and in the other one I was driving my bright red (fire-engine red) F-150.

My point here is that it's not that people "have it in" for motorcycles, it's that there are a lot of bad, sloppy, distracted drivers out there and anybody who uses the road needs to expect that. That includes motorcyclists.

And if motorcyclists don't like it, then they can stay off the road - I know a lot of riders who have done just that, decided the streets are too dangerous so they only ride track or on trails.

But motorcycle rider's aren't a "protected class" and are not entitled to any greater degree of deference or courtesy simply because they choose to use a more dangerous form of transportation. If they're not willing to accept the additional risk that comes along with riding on the streets and highways then they need to not ride in those places, not get road ragey when someone does something they don't like.

[fitz19d]

Preach it, Brother. I'm another long-time rider (39 years) who has no patience with motorcyclists who act like assholes on the grounds that "cage drivers are out to kill us!"

My thought is: If you're that scared of car drivers, stay off the road.

Funny thing, within the past 5 days I had two incidents where people who should have seen me pulled right into my lane of traffic nearly causing an accident. Both incidents happened during the daylight.

In one of them I was driving my wife's Honda CR-V and in the other one I was driving my bright red (fire-engine red) F-150.

My point here is that it's not that people "have it in" for motorcycles, it's that there are a lot of bad, sloppy, distracted drivers out there and anybody who uses the road needs to expect that. That includes motorcyclists.

And if motorcyclists don't like it, then they can stay off the road - I know a lot of riders who have done just that, decided the streets are too dangerous so they only ride track or on trails.

But motorcycle rider's aren't a "protected class" and are not entitled to any greater degree of deference or courtesy simply because they choose to use a more dangerous form of transportation. If they're not willing to accept the additional risk that comes along with riding on the streets and highways then they need to not ride in those places, not get road ragey when someone does something they don't like.

Had to jump into the express lane when some twat at 6am tried to merge ontop of my jag which has red wrap accents and pretty bright headlights. It's so bad on i25 towards Denver anymore, I have a hard time faulting any road rager thats endangered by these utter idiots on the road. Usually the ones almost fucking my day up of course are in old usually batterered pieces of shit I imagine are under or not insured.

I will only ride my bike towards Denver daylight hours on the weekend at this point, or north Ft collins i25 ish where at least it's 2 lanes straight with enough traffic you get more limited people making erratic quick jumps in lanes.

[Vic Tory]

Too many of these News stories about these incidents "start" in the middle of the story. This MAY be another....

What happened BEFORE this woman allegedly "intentionally" hit the guy's bike? What did he do? What did she do? Immediately after the minor accident what did the biker and his friends do or say to her?

Leaving the scene of an accident reads like she was a Hitter and Runner.

The biker and "witnesses" (plural) followed her. Were they threatening her, or did she just choose to "play victim" of some "nasty bikers?"

Why on earth would she go back outside and point a gun at any of them??!!!

What a MESS!!!

_________________


My brother rode a motorcycle. He CONSTANTLY told us about drivers looking right at him, and then changing lanes as if he wasn't there. I remember our insurance agent giving him articles explaining that too many drivers are not *looking* for a motorcycle, so they don't SEE the motorcycle. I vowed to never be one of "those drivers." And I still vividly recall the time -- 40 years ago -- I nearly wiped-out a biker on I-25. At the last moment I flinched back into my lane and looked again. I almost fainted! It was morning rush hour; he had nowhere to go if I'd completed that lane change...!

[MrPrena]

I would probably back off unless I have overwhelming evidences/proof, and witness that she is the one who was going crazy road rage.

At this time , it is he said ? she died.

[Squeeze]

The initial reason I called this a "good shoot" is because she was literally inside the safety of her home while the cyclist waited outside for police to arrive. She then proceeded to exit the house with a firearm in tow. He didn't engage her until she presented a lethal threat (what I gathered from my poking around on Google). I do agree with the idea of getting make/model/license and descriptors of the driver and then disengage. In my old HnR case, I received SBI and the jerk took off. No one on I-25 that morning thought to follow him or get a plate for responding LE. At the time (1998), Detective Rok with DPD said he gets 15 HnR cases a day and he's not the only detective handling them. Imagine it's gotten worse in recent years.