Keep it classy DC!

[Irving]

Owning a Hummer in any urban environment deserve a snowball to the nuts anyway.

I used to drive them around when I was a lot tech at a car dealership. They are too big, very slow, terrible blind spots, and over all unreliable junk. The interior is alarmingly uncomfortable and cramped for such a large vehicle.

I'm talking about H1 Hummers of course. In this case, converting a military vehicle to something people would drive every day was a terrible idea. Worst civilian vehicle ever.


One time, these yokles strolled onto the dealership and drove up with a used Hummer (which were all priced at $17,000 over book value by the way). Anyway, they went straight to the gas station at the end of the street and topped it off with unleaded. It came back the next day on a flat bed. I guess they got lucky and the motor only bent some valves or something. It was a riot.

[two shoes]

Here we go, this might make a good discussion. The plainsclothes idiot did not fire a shot and it is unknown if he even drew down on someone... All that's said is that he unholstered and held at his side. While this is definitely brandishing, I'm not sure the CCW would've been justified at all if he/she stepped in. I'm sure it could've gotten really nasty, really quick.

I don't know if CCW is allowed in DC either. With all the politics and stuff there, I highly doubt it or if it is, I'm sure they pay a premium.

At what angle would a person likely consider the gun to be pointed at them... If in a shoulder holster, someone would likely be crossed by the muzzle, whereas a side/hip holster, it is plausable to keep the muzzle pointed at the ground...

[SA Friday]

No CCW in DC. ONly cops and criminals are allowed to carry. Keeps everyone safe..

[two shoes]

No CCW in DC. ONly cops and criminals are allowed to carry. Keeps everyone safe..

[GreenScoutII]

200 guys having a snowball fight? AWESOME!!!!

As far as the cop drawing his weapon, I'll wait to hear the rest of the story. I think most LEO's are good people who wouldn't draw unless there was good reason. If it turns out he drew his gun just because his car got hit by a snowball he deserves a reprimand at the very least.

[Irving]

No need to wait.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMrhiBwF4MU

I think maybe he should have just produced his badge, instead of his gun. That unnecessarily escalates things.

[BigBear]

At what angle would a person likely consider the gun to be pointed at them... If in a shoulder holster, someone would likely be crossed by the muzzle, whereas a side/hip holster, it is plausable to keep the muzzle pointed at the ground...

Very good thoughts.

As far as the hummer thing, I'm used to living out in the boonies/sticks, etc. I would love (yes as a civilian) to have an old military surplus hummer. All those times getting stuck in the mud or trying to pull out a stump or blah, blah, blah. On the other hand: I wouldn't set foot in one of those civilian "H" models.

Agreed, I think most cops are decent folks... but it just takes one idiot... lol.

HAHAHA... Watched the video. The dude is stopped in the MIDDLE of the street! He's also STANDING in the MIDDLE of the street impedeing traffic!! Sounds like he was having a bad day before his car got hit.


Serisouly though... 200 man snowball fight! Get there a few hours early, build a fort, stock up on ammo! It would've been on with my buddies and I! ATTACK!!! HAHA.

[TFOGGER]

If I showed so much as a gun in a holster because somebody nailed my car with a snowball, I'd be in jail facing felony menacing charges. Why should a plainclothes, apparently off duty cop be any different?

I get that he was pissed, but a gun is never the right response to a snowball....

[SA Friday]

If I showed so much as a gun in a holster because somebody nailed my car with a snowball, I'd be in jail facing felony menacing charges. Why should a plainclothes, apparently off duty cop be any different?

I get that he was pissed, but a gun is never the right response to a snowball....

LE personnel are obligated to protect citizens and themselves. You as a private citizen have no obligation to protect either. The key is the cops are obligated weather they want to or not or they can face action that would not apply to you. Hence, escalating to a show of force (pulling a handgun from it's holster) for LE is within acceptable levels. LE personnel are allowed to escalate force to one level above the oppositions. A private citizen can essentially escalate force to the level of opposition. A group of dozens against one cop standing in the middle of what could obviously turn precarious, drawing may seem extreme but I wouldn't start comparing his obligations to non LE's over it.

DC is probably the toughest cop gig in the USA. Had a buddy that was a DC cop when I was stationed at Andrews back in the mid 90's. He quit after shooting and killing two kids that rushed him out of nowhere with guns; trying to get their tear tattoos... He was in uniform and on foot patrol. DC isn't even as nice as the worst part of CO on a bad day. Cut the guy some slack. After watching the vid, I could see that situation going real bad long before he ever got to the intersection. He diffused it. It's hard to prove his actions may have saved someones life, but it's too easy to criticize.

[Troublco]

LE personnel are obligated to protect citizens and themselves. You as a private citizen have no obligation to protect either. The key is the cops are obligated weather they want to or not or they can face action that would not apply to you. Hence, escalating to a show of force (pulling a handgun from it's holster) for LE is within acceptable levels. LE personnel are allowed to escalate force to one level above the oppositions. A private citizen can essentially escalate force to the level of opposition. A group of dozens against one cop standing in the middle of what could obviously turn precarious, drawing may seem extreme but I wouldn't start comparing his obligations to non LE's over it.

DC is probably the toughest cop gig in the USA. Had a buddy that was a DC cop when I was stationed at Andrews back in the mid 90's. He quit after shooting and killing two kids that rushed him out of nowhere with guns; trying to get their tear tattoos... He was in uniform and on foot patrol. DC isn't even as nice as the worst part of CO on a bad day. Cut the guy some slack. After watching the vid, I could see that situation going real bad long before he ever got to the intersection. He diffused it. It's hard to prove his actions may have saved someones life, but it's too easy to criticize.

Not that I'm faulting anyone for their opinion, but it's really easy to armchair quarterback things like this after it's over. Especially somewhere like DC. Places like that, it might as well be open season on law enforcement. I think it's a good thing that nobody, officer included, came out of it with a toe tag. I find it amazing that police are willing to do their jobs at all in these days of video cameras in everyone's hand, where it's easy to edit any context at all right out of it. I'm not excusing bad cops, but it's damn hard for the good ones just to do their jobs.