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That's all fine and dandy. But no court or judge has ordered the ATF to, 1) find these items are machineguns and, 2) ordered the ATF to start confiscating property of US citizens without due process.
The ATF is acting unilaterally as far as anyone can tell. I don't care how you try to justify their behavior, it simply isn't in accordance with US law.
Stella - my best girl ever.
11/04/1994 - 12/23/2010
Don't wanna get shot by the police?
"Stop Resisting Arrest!"
Correct. There is no law, the atf can fall back on regarding their abuse .Originally Posted by Bailey Guns
The Great Kazoo's Feedback
"when you're happy you enjoy the melody but, when you're broken you understand the lyrics".
I call BS...
They aren't going down this path without the support and backing of Uncle Joey and the DOJ.
Is it legal, by the definition of the law? Nope, but much like your signature, if you don't want the ATF to make an example out of you, don't make a device that imitates FA and flaunt it...
RDIAS
Lightning Links
Bump stocks
Blah blah blah...
NONE of those fit the definition of a Firearm, and yet they are highly controlled or illegal as a "machine gun"... The courts have never once taken umbrage with that stance... Why would they start with this latest example?
Last edited by Grant H.; 01-28-2022 at 14:13.
Yet again, not justifying their behavior.
There's a lot of guys serving prison sentences constantly yelling about how their imprisonment is not in accordance with US law and/or they didn't break the law.
And many of them are not wrong.
I am, I suppose, much more pragmatic than idealistic. I'd love it to be the way you guys suggest, but it simply isn't.
It shouldn't be, but it is.
Things like the ATF are like a freakin' 500 pound, hundred-year old, pissed off, shit covered gorilla living a bedroom. While it would be awesome if it could become civilized and trained, and eat at the dinner table, who are we kidding? You don't try to dress it up in yoga pants and give it a fork, you just keep far away and hope it eventually croaks.
Gotta agree on both highlighted part.
ATF was starting to do this on their own around last year of Trump admin. That would most likely without a backing of doj at that time.
Now, it is most likely that they have a backing of doj and wh.
The ATF was acting at the direction of Trump and his DOJ when they went after the Bump stocks...
That's BS? OK. Show me it's BS. Prove to me the WH or DOJ is behind this.
DOJ maybe...but if so they sure are being quiet about it. Rare Breed stood up to the ATF on specific, valid, legal grounds. And, much like FoxtArt said, so far the courts could give a shit about legal. Personally, I think that's what's behind this. The peasants dared to speak out and challenge the authority of the ATF. An organization that doesn't even have a director and hasn't had one for some time. And now the ATF is gonna pound their asses into the dirt because they know they can, legally and justifiably or not. They know they don't need anyone's permission...especially under this administration.
Frankly I think the WH is grateful for this distraction. They've made such a cluster fuck of everything they've touched: they've been shown to be illegally transporting illegal aliens around the country and lying about it to the point even those on their side are starting to blow the whistle, they're on the brink of war with Putin, inflation is running rampant, the middle class is being priced out of a sustainable lifestyle, there's revolt in their own party...and on and on and on. Yeah..."Let the ATF ruin a few lives and give us a little breathing room" is probably what the WH is thinking right now.
Stella - my best girl ever.
11/04/1994 - 12/23/2010
Don't wanna get shot by the police?
"Stop Resisting Arrest!"
The process was not the same. Under Trump they at least gave the illusion of due process. They had hearings, comment periods, wrote a regulation, etc. Then they did what they wanted anyway.
That isn't happening here. They've flat out said these devices meet the definition of "machine gun" - which is a lie, lied about how they operate in court by saying they fire more than one round with a single trigger pull, and sent out a directive to start confiscating property. Apples and oranges.
The result might be the same and I suppose that's all that matters in the end. But the processes for each aren't comparable.
Stella - my best girl ever.
11/04/1994 - 12/23/2010
Don't wanna get shot by the police?
"Stop Resisting Arrest!"
And they gave purchasers an opportunity to destroy or turnover the device with no harm except money flushed.
All eight people that ever bought a slide fire thanked them for being so kind.
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