Ukraine - Take two

[Great-Kazoo]

This is a war by proxy against Russia and we need to win it, so that we get rid of Putin and send a clear warning to china that the world can be united against bullies. We have a once in history opportunity to force a major political change in Russia… this is priceless.

Based on how ineffective we were for the first 2 weeks. I doubt Chi-Na is worried what our, or the worlds, response would be. Once they're on the island. They sure as ^&* ain't leaving .

[ruthabagah]

Putin is going to die soon anyway, I don't see how spending fortunes and screwing our economy even further is better for us than waiting him out.

And Ukraine isn't going to win no matter how much money we spend. So to that end it's a waste anyway.

And BTW, lots of that money is buying Ukrainian important people new mansions in other countries where they can escape to. It's not directly helping the war by any means.

Funny, it’s like reading the FSB propaganda manual or the America First party statements before ww2… Let Putin win and the next target will be your backyard. Russia will run out of ordnance by July. It’s a war of attrition, and ultimately Ukraine will prevail. We need to stay the course and win this one.

[ruthabagah]

Based on how ineffective we were for the first 2 weeks. I doubt Chi-Na is worried what our, or the worlds, response would be. Once they're on the island. They sure as ^&* ain't leaving .

Except they won?t get there? if Russia can?t roll into Ukraine how do you think china is going to land in Taiwan? Their military is even more corrupted than the Russian one? Their tanks are not maintained and their troop have low morale. Now, they are watching and learning from the Ukraine war. Not a good thing.

[hollohas]

Russia will run out of ordnance by July. It?s a war of attrition, and ultimately Ukraine will prevail. We need to stay the course and win this one.

I'm not so sure. Russia is taking heavy losses for sure. And it's awful good to see how ineffective they truly are. However, they're still going to take much of Ukraine. And they're going to learn A LOT while doing it. They WERE ineffective, but they won't be when Ukraine is decided. It's a training ground for them and their military industrial complex is ramping up to keep them in it too. I'd prefer they stayed the old, drunk, rusted, ineffective and overrated military they were. I'd rather we weren't helping them learn how to fight again making them better for when they come at us.

PS - and them fighting against our weapons is only going to help them learn how to defend against them.

[Great-Kazoo]

I'm not so sure. Russia is taking heavy losses for sure. And it's awful good to see how ineffective they truly are. However, they're still going to take much of Ukraine. And they're going to learn A LOT while doing it. They WERE ineffective, but they won't be when Ukraine is decided. It's a training ground for them and their military industrial complex is ramping up to keep them in it too. I'd prefer they stayed the old, drunk, rusted, ineffective and overrated military they were. I'd rather we weren't helping them learn how to fight again making them better for when they come at us.

PS - and them fighting against our weapons is only going to help them learn how to defend against them.

My tinfoil hat says the entire "conflict" was the only way russia & chi-na could gain access to US .mil hardware. Other than industrial espionage, which carries long prison terms, or death. This way, every (ok) almost every western power has been sending them current, or last gen hardware.

[theGinsue]

I side with the Ukraine. They haven't been hitting our site like the Russians have been. Just this morning I had to block almost 200k IP's and delete near 100 new Russian span accounts that were created since last night. F Russia!

[Aloha_Shooter]

Funny, it’s like reading the FSB propaganda manual or the America First party statements before ww2… Let Putin win and the next target will be your backyard. Russia will run out of ordnance by July. It’s a war of attrition, and ultimately Ukraine will prevail. We need to stay the course and win this one.

The big difference is that the American public didn't have good information on what was really going on in Germany in 1939 and 1940. The America First party were largely peple who had been scarred or seen family members and friends scarred by the first World War and didn't want to see America spending blood and treasure in another fruitless European conflict. That's compared to our full knowledge of how Putin has continued to push the boundaries as he has been allowed to have his way with just seizing Crimea, murdering political enemies, etc. Lindbergh went from pushing for isolationism with the America First party to fully supporting the war efforts and actually risking his life on combat missions (illicitly) to help the American Pacific forces eke more performance from their aircraft.

[FoxtArt]

Trump spent more in 4 years than any other US president, ever. Isn't the concern over 50 billion and the blind eye towards 7 trillion (Trump deficit increased ~140 times as much) kind of hypocritical?

Note too that T was spending more than historical presidents even before the pandemic. He loved those stimulus checks so much he wanted to brand them with his name and letterhead.

If people want to bitch about spending, I am 100% on board. Above all else I am a fiscal conservative. Just don't complain about the neighbors spending $2,000 on an ATV while you're behind on payments for your $350,000 yacht while working a 60k/year job. (USA analogy).

Also bear in mind he promised to "pay the national debt off". Can we run an actual conservative for 2024?

[FoxtArt]

Truth be told too, Russia is a country with a lot of land but most of it inhospital. They have been decreasing in pop since the 1990s. Ignoring Ukraine is to give the soviets a breadbasket and resources to once again become a real threat. Stop then in Ukraine and Russia will die off on its own accord. China is the bigger problem, but enemies are must easier to handle when you don't ignore them. Ignore Russia and the future would have a united RU and CH front that would make WW2 pale in comparison. Kick their ass now, and China stands alone, containable, with a possibility that things never come down to a contest of arms.

[eddiememphis]

Trump spent more in 4 years than any other US president, ever. Isn't the concern over 50 billion and the blind eye towards 7 trillion (Trump deficit increased ~140 times as much) kind of hypocritical?

Can we run an actual conservative for 2024?

7T versus 50b isn't an accurate comparison. Total spending versus unique foreign policy action.

However, I agree, President Trump showed no fiscal responsibility. His fans never seem to acknowledge that.

Regarding an "actual conservative", the likely answer to your question is no. There are no true conservatives on the national scene, fiscal or social.