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  1. #31
    Zombie Slayer
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    We haven't even used the really lethal weapons. We have been giving away things that have sat in storage for decades.
    We have been transferring the stuff we developed with Windows 95. I'll leave the rest to your imagination.

    My last post on this thread.
    Per Ardua ad Astra

  2. #32
    Machine Gunner clodhopper's Avatar
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    Should we have never supported Ukraine? Dunno. But I do know at this point we need to stop. We have spent well beyond our fair part in this situation (roughly double everyone else combined). Europe has a much greater responsibility and has done much less.
    14 . Always carry a change of underwear.

  3. #33
    Loves Paintball ruthabagah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clodhopper View Post
    Should we have never supported Ukraine? Dunno. But I do know at this point we need to stop. We have spent well beyond our fair part in this situation (roughly double everyone else combined). Europe has a much greater responsibility and has done much less.
    What do you know about Europe’s assistance to Ukraine? Judging by your comment, not much… if you are not understanding what is at stake and why we need to keep on providing support until this war is over, then please, inform yourself and maybe stop falling prey to the fsb propaganda machine.
    "The French soldiers are grand. They are grand. There is no other word to express it."
    - Arthur Conan Doyle, A visit to three fronts (1916)

  4. #34
    Grand Master Know It All Hummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruthabagah View Post
    What do you know about Europe?s assistance to Ukraine? Judging by your comment, not much? if you are not understanding what is at stake and why we need to keep on providing support until this war is over, then please, inform yourself and maybe stop falling prey to the fsb propaganda machine.

    The FSB propaganda machine is hard at their work right here on this forum. The failure to recognize what Russia is and has always been, and it's real threat to our country and civilized societies worldwide brings and astounding display of ignorance of world history.

    One person asked me what Russia has done to me. It said all that I need to know about that person.


    A recent interview with the Director of Central Intelligence is revealing about the US position and response to the dangerous dictatorial regimes that the civilized world faces.

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/william...pt-02-26-2023/

  5. #35
    a cool, fancy title hollohas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BushMasterBoy View Post
    We haven't even used the really lethal weapons. We have been giving away things that have sat in storage for decades.
    We have been transferring the stuff we developed with Windows 95. I'll leave the rest to your imagination.

    My last post on this thread.
    Of course they're not getting our newest. But what they are getting is extremely effective even though it is old tech. And now they're learning how to deal with it so our old but effective tech won't be effective much longer. Then only our new tech will be effective, reducing our options.

  6. #36
    Loves Paintball ruthabagah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hummer View Post
    The FSB propaganda machine is hard at their work right here on this forum. The failure to recognize what Russia is and has always been, and it's real threat to our country and civilized societies worldwide brings and astounding display of ignorance of world history.

    One person asked me what Russia has done to me. It said all that I need to know about that person.


    A recent interview with the Director of Central Intelligence is revealing about the US position and response to the dangerous dictatorial regimes that the civilized world faces.

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/william...pt-02-26-2023/
    Yep… saw that too. Might be time to check some ip address redirect and look at users profile….
    "The French soldiers are grand. They are grand. There is no other word to express it."
    - Arthur Conan Doyle, A visit to three fronts (1916)

  7. #37
    Machine Gunner clodhopper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruthabagah View Post
    What do you know about Europe’s assistance to Ukraine? Judging by your comment, not much…
    https://www.cfr.org/article/how-much...are-six-charts
    https://www.usnews.com/news/best-cou...aid-to-ukraine
    https://www.statista.com/chart/27278...ne-by-country/
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...-Ukrainian_War

    Some are a bit dated, I seem to remember we are somewhere at or over $100B to Ukraine at this point. Where do we stop? All this is printed money that inflates our fiat. 1 Trillion? No limit?

    Keep in mind...
    https://www.usdebtclock.org/

    Quote Originally Posted by ruthabagah View Post
    if you are not understanding what is at stake and why we need to keep on providing support until this war is over, then please, inform yourself and maybe stop falling prey to the fsb propaganda machine.
    Are you on the DNC/Biden payroll? falling prey to FSB prop machine... funny stuff. Ukraine is about the most corrupt pile o crap in existence. Russia isnt far behind. Tell me in simple terms why we need to spend unlimited money on a dispute between two corrupt clownshows?

    Our leadership keeps ratcheting up tensions with Putin on this issue. It is as if Biden (or the committee of people making him talk) are trying to get us into a war with Russia or China. And THAT matters more to me than the damn money.
    14 . Always carry a change of underwear.

  8. #38
    Zombie Slayer Aloha_Shooter's Avatar
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    I am against the unlimited checks being pushed (especially since "the big guy" probably figured out how to get his 10%, hence his shift in position) but I do still think it's important to make Putin realize his expansionism is at an end. His recent withdrawal or pause on the START agreements is -- to me -- an indication that he realizes he has very few options now.

    China is watching this with great interest. We cannot afford for them to decide to invade Taiwan -- either because Putin gets away with his annexation of portions of Ukraine or because they think we've shot our load in Ukraine and don't have enough left to help Taiwan. This is one of the reasons we used to plan for 2 front wars -- not because we wanted to fight on 2 fronts but so no actor started a second war thinking the first one gobbled up our entire capability.

  9. #39
    Zombie Slayer Aloha_Shooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hollohas View Post
    My main concern is that we're giving our advisories an amazing opportunity to learn all about our weapons, learn how to defeat or defend against them and access to them so they can reverse engineer them for their own use.
    I would say that we're learning more about their weaknesses than they are about ours. The Ukrainians have been fighting effectively by combining real time situational awareness with a knowledge of Russian doctrine and innovative tactics to counter that doctrine. The TTPs they are developing may or may not be useful in defending Taiwan (lines of tanks probably aren't in the PRC game plan but the landing beaches are just as effective choke points) but there are lessons to apply in other combat regions and situations. So far, the only weapon I can see Russia learning much about is the Javelin and they don't seem to have had many opportunities to get info on it as their only observers end up either killed or captured.

  10. #40
    Grand Master Know It All eddiememphis's Avatar
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    If I may interject again...

    No one here seems to have changed his mind about the necessity or fallacy of America's support of this war.

    Correct?

    Has anyone that though it was a good idea last year decided against it? Or the other way around?

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