C&R and background checks

[321eod]

Question..

I have a C&R permit. If I want to buy a firearm do I still need to do a CBI background check?

Is the answer different in the following circumstances:

Buying from a gun show versus a gun shop?

Buying C&R eligible versus 'normal' firearm?

thanks in advance for any advice

Steve

[blackford76]

If the gun you want to buy is C&R classified, then you just need to give the seller a copy of your FFL. If you are getting a "normal" gun, you still have to do a background check. Show or shop shouldnt matter.

[Zundfolge]

I'm not sure you can walk into a gun shop in your home state and buy a C&R gun without filling out a 4473 and going through the NICS.

I'd like to hear a Type 01 FFL weigh in on this one.

[Bailey Guns]

A C&R licensed collector is not required to fill out a 4473. However, a Type 01 dealer may require a 4473 and NICS check as a CYA type thing as there is no "EZ Check" verification in place for C&R licensees. I knew several collector's in the area and when they bought from me I'd enter their C&R license information into my bound book just as if it were a Type 01 licensee I was transferring the gun to.

Obviously, this only applies to C&R eligible firearms.

Here's an excerpt from the ATF website:


Q: Are licensed collectors required to execute ATF Form 4473 for transactions in curio or relic firearms?

No. However, licensed collectors are required to keep a “bound book” record.
[27 CFR 478.125(f)]

[321eod]

Appreciate the responses - especially the link to the fed's view - that is helpful. I'll print it out and take it with me! Ultimately I suppose it's up to the individual seller/dealer on the day!

The reason I asked is that I go to gun shows regularly and as a non-US citizen (I am a perm res) it's very time consuming to get the checks done

Thanks again - great forum and I look forward to 'lurking'

Regards

Steve

[7idl]

this was the reason I stopped doing business with Green Mountain.

I wanted to buy a C&R, I produced an ID and a copy of my FFL (C&R) and they wouldn't do it.

their choice.

they don't recognize my FFL, I don't recognize theirs.

vote with your feet and wallet

[MuzzleFlash]

I'm not sure you can walk into a gun shop in your home state and buy a C&R gun without filling out a 4473 and going through the NICS.

I'd like to hear a Type 01 FFL weigh in on this one.

I'm a type 07 FFL and the answer is yes. In fact, you can also buy a C&R machinegun like the Reising Model 50 and transfer it over state lines from an individual seller. You would do so on a tax paid Form 4. You still have to get the CLEO signoff and fingerprints, etc., but the C&R allows you to bypass a local C2/C3 SOT dealer and saves you one $200 transfer in the case I just described.

321eod, don't take this wrong, but for someone with a FFL you don't seem to understand the most basic of regulations that apply to you. If you have a C&R license (not a permit, there is no such thing) then you need to get in touch with ATF regs. You are required to maintain an A&D book. There are record retention requirements. Did you know that? Do you have a A&D book or suitable electronic record? If not, Brownells is a good place to buy one. You can be audited just like a commercial FFL but you have the option of telling the ATF that you want the audit to happen on their premises, not yours. You don't have a business premises like commercial FFLs so you can conduct transfers in places we can't. Your license won't show up in the ATF's FFL ezCheck. There's much more.

Here's a FAQ to get you started:
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/collectors.html

[uhplumber]

I have my C&R. I asked at Gander Mountain if they would accept my license on a Mosin purchase. The answer was no. Seems like there is a lot of CYA going on. I don't get it.

[Zundfolge]

On a side note, Steve, did you get those PM's I sent?