Plug-in hybrids?

[Jer]

that is all.

Like your ally on this one, do ya?

the saying is "right on CUE".

And you ALWAYS make it personal. It seems like Sawin mad a good post. Hybrids are the happy place for most people's needs. Maybe electric only works for you. That good too. I think you are old enough not to get bent out of shape because people dont necessarily like what you like. All you need to do is present the unbiased, noninflammatory data or experience you have. However, you have been consistently unable to do that.

From the master of resorting to personally attacking people at all times in hopes that nobody will recognize when they're clueless on a topic himself comes this gem of a response.

[Eric P]

Is there a big market for these overseas? I see the stats that say it was the #1 sold car in the world, but it's not even the #1 sold car in the U.S.

Number 1 is some Chinese brand EV. They are building a factory in Mexico hoping to skirt the tariffs on Chinese EVs with NAFTA and flood the US market with sub $20K EVs.

[Jer]

Is there a big market for these overseas? I see the stats that say it was the #1 sold car in the world, but it's not even the #1 sold car in the U.S.

Yuge.

I think that the Model Y was the highest selling model in California (go figure, lol) as well as 6 other states (WA, NV, CO, VA, MD, NJ) but it was 5th in the US overall. We still love our pickup trucks. It's head & shoulders above the rest of the competitors in the rest of the world though, making it the #1 vehicle sold worldwide. With how quickly Tesla is building Gigafactories and bringing them online & given their growth curve based on units sold, these #'s will likely be paltry this time next year. They went #5 in 2022 to #1 in 2023. Pretty big jump in a pretty short period of time and impressive by any standard.

Hell, even I used to not be a fan of the Model Y. The ride quality was harsh and they were really noisy compared to the Model S/X plus there were a few quirks I just wasn't a fan of. Tesla listened to the criticism and made some really good improvements in the way of a few dozen small quality-of-life upgrades that make it not only livable but really good now. All quietly and with little to no fanfare like most of their updates. What most other car manufacturers do every few years with incremental generation updates, Tesla does in a few months. Just part of the benefits to being smaller and more nimble.

The overall utility of the Model Y is incredible and why we ended up getting two of them (2023 at the start of 2023 & a 2024 a couple months ago) having previously always gone with the Model S. For us, I preferred the look of the Model S much more to the Model Y but the practicality of the Model Y day-to-day is undeniable and one of my favorite aspects of them.

[Eric P]

My big issue with EVs is why couldn't they just take an ICE car, replace the tank and motor with a battery and electric motor? All these connected gimmicks and required subscriptions just turn me off.

Why does the car maker need to talk to the car after I buy it? The only time it should talk to my car is when I ask them to.

[Jer]

Number 1 is some Chinese brand EV. They are building a factory in Mexico hoping to skirt the tariffs on Chinese EVs with NAFTA and flood the US market with sub $20K EVs.

Orly?

[Jer]

My big issue with EVs is why couldn't they just take an ICE car, replace the tank and motor with a battery and electric motor? All these connected gimmicks and required subscriptions just turn me off.

Why does the car maker need to talk to the car after I buy it? The only time it should talk to my car is when I ask them to.

I hate monthly subscriptions too. Tesla doesn't have a single subscription unless you want streaming music and live Google traffic data on your navigation. Otherwise, I can interact with just about any setting within my car that you can think of from the app completely free-of-charge. Having to pay a monthly service charge to remote start your vehicle to warm it up or cool it off or adjust the heat seaters or is laughable to me.

As for using existing platforms to build EVs, this is the worst way to make an EV IMO. Trying to retroactively cram items into spaces that they weren't intended for always ends up in a final product with hundreds of compromises that affects the performance & user experience. This is where most of the established manufacturers go wrong because they want to save money by using existing platforms and just taping crap in places where voids are created from removing the ICE components. This is a compromised approach foundationally that yields an inferior product that meets a timeline and price point at the cost of just about everything else.

I may have misunderstood your post though because I'm not sure why you stated those two topics are linked. To me, they're separate. You can most certainly do a ground-up new EV or an EV based on existing platform and still have an independent decisions on if you charge recurring charges for other "features" within each platform.

For me, the best EV will have a fully engineered platform from the ground up that is purpose-built for the best end product. Anything less than that is purely a money/time (mostly money) saving tactic for the manufacturer.

As for required subscriptions... eff that noise! I ain't payin' no monthly service charge for anything. That's just me though as it seems to make the world go 'round in most people's eyes. I go out of my way to not buy into ecosystems that come with additional recurring fees and/or higher costs down the road.

Another reason I love Tesla (and EVs in general in this sense) because I have no maintenance costs after purchase and my operation costs are fractional compared to their ICE powered counterparts. We've already saved over $20k on gas & oil changes alone. That doesn't even factor in maintenance costs of all of the scheduled services of ICE cars let alone unscheduled items that fail pretty regularly based on my experience.

[Martinjmpr]

There will be some here who will attack me because of some weird political agenda and how they associate that with the car you drive. If you're able to disassociate your politics from what you drive and listen to this advice, you'll likely thank yourself after only a brief period of ownership:

Get a Tesla Model Y Long Range AWD.
....

I know you're a ways away in Pueblo but I'm happy to let you drive ours. The same offer is extended to anyone else reading this who's closer to our neck of the woods. If you do so with an open mind I have no doubt you'll come around just like we did. They're really that good and much of the negative BS you hear parroted by those who have never owned one is just that... BS.

That's a great answer.....
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To a question I didn't ask.

[Erni]

ROI is not there on an electric unless you drive a ton.
And retirees will probably never see an upside on a testlab vs a basic Toyota phev.

[buffalobo]

As of 2024, Consumer Reports ranks Tesla?s overall brand #14 of the 30 car brands that they?ve tested.
Their rankings are based on Tesla?s predicted reliability score.?


https://caredge.com/guides/most-reli...bility%20score.



This makes Tesla auto insurance premiums approximately 50% pricier than for the average vehicle with a full-coverage policy.


https://www.marketwatch.com/guides/i...20car%20models.


29% of electric vehicle owners are considering a switch back to a traditional combustion engine car


https://www.google.com/amp/s/cleante...y-edition/amp/

If you're unarmed, you are a victim.

[ben4372]

Orly?

This is pretty amazing. Kinda makes me wonder why Tesla stock isnt doing better. Elon must have pissed people off.