Aluminum vs. Steel?

[cowboykjohnson]

Subscribed for inevitable e-fight.

+1

[Hannu]

What does this really mean ?

Subscribed for inevitable e-fight.

Usually, military guns have noticeably slower cyclic rate than good IPSC / 3-gun etc. match rifles.
By cyclic rate I mean, how fast rifle is making one cycle. We can say it way, how many rounds a rifle can fire in theory during one minute if it would have 2000 rd mag

When we took hi-speed camera photos about AR-15 rifles cycling, typical 20" match rifle cycle time was about 30-35% faster when compared to stock 20" milspec rifle. S&B 55gr bulk factory ammo from the same box, of course
What is problem with Pmag (and many other mags), is that mag can not lift top round up fast enough - bolt will hit the round somewhere to the side.

With some ammunition types / rifles, there have been the same problem with 100% stock rifles also. I have seen people replacing Pmags with better springs - helps for some time, but mag lips will break up a lot faster. I think, they can not put very strong spring to Pmag without making Glock-style mag with steel feeding lips.


I would say, Pmag is probably the best polymer AR-15 magazine available. Is that good or bad, everyone has to decide by themselves

When you want to build a good match rifle, you want it to cycle fast and sharp = fast sight picture recovery. That is why many people use lightweight moving parts but original return spring - bolt/carrier/buffer assembly is spending much less time slammed bottom of a buffer tube and will accelerate faster forwards = faster cycle.

If you have problems that bolt does not have enough power to take round from the mag, your rifles moving parts weight/travel/spring weight etc. are out of balance.

It is whole another thing with mags is when temperature gets below 30 degrees, more about that maybe later

[sniper7]

I have used them all and haven't had any magazine problems the entire time I have shot ARs.
I have not had an HK mag because I never wanted to pay the price of them, but handling them they seem like excellent quality.

I mostly just use my Pmags now. they a nice and smooth, feed reliably and don't mind to be dropped.

the only issue I have with the PMAG is it seems like they don't accept my longer handloads quite as well as the GI mags, so i had to work up a different shorter load because of it. (the pdogs don't know any difference when they explode though)

[sniper7]

What does this really mean ?

Just means there is going to be a good discussion, maybe heated about a certain topic on the internet! On ar15.com, if the thread lasts long enough, it usually ends up with more than 1 person being banned and the thread getting locked!

[Irving]

Hannu, there are a lot of people who love magpul products and think they can do no wrong, so when you posted your experience about how they didn't work for you, I expected all the fan boys to crawl out of the wood work and yell at you for what you said. I sometimes forget that this isn't AR15.com and that probably won't happen here. I'd love to see this fight over there though. lol

[SA Friday]

I can see a JP LMOS having the issues Hannu is talking about. Like I said, I haven't played with the LMOS systems at all. I understand the parts and concepts very well, but that's different than getting out there and playing with them at the higher speeds that shooting competitions happen at.

There is such a following for Pmags because they do work well for the most part. The one thing many overlook is when a pmag craps the bed, it's visually obvious. The feed lip chips, cracks, breaks... When an aluminium or steel mage craps the bed, you usually can't tell till it's in the gun and causing all kinds of grief. Tactically, it makes a lot of sense to carry the pmags. They are cheap and easy to just throw away and get another one. Competition wise, I can see using aluminium and steel mags simply for the longevity. I just hate checking feed lips all the time... Every time I qualified for the AF, I would pull mags out and start measuring the feed lips. Everyone thought I was nuts (...maybe just a little), but I very rarely had problems when qualifying.

I have both pmags and aluminum mags in my armada like arsenal . I'll pass on the HK mags and steel ones. I just don't shoot AR's enough to warrant the expense. If I ever get financially stable again after college, I might look into rounding out my gear and getting out to a match or two. Things might change then. For the average shooter, I really don't see a need for the steel mags.

[Troublco]

This went a lot further than I thought it would, but a great bunch of info. I like the steel mags I have for my Grendel, but they are a bit heavier. I doubt if I'd go out of my way to get the same for my other rifles, with the possible exception of my .458. I have plenty of GI aluminum and PMags, and I see no reason to think those won't work fine. I do check the way the follower sits on the spring to make sure on my GI 20's I don't get the nosedive on the follower, and I inspect the feedlips regularly but I can't remember when I had a problem as long as I took care of my mags. Of course, I try not to drop mine either. That's what cargo pockets or dump bags are for.

Sorry you didn't get a fight, Irving. Well, not really, but I didn't really expect one on here anyhow!

[sabot_round]

Here ia a LINK to a product that I wouldn't mind trying.

[cowboykjohnson]

Had a write up about them in one of the recent NRA shooter mags. Supposed to be very good mags and they make quality extra high capacity... I think like 42 rd.... for the 3 gun and other competitive shooting sports.

[Troublco]

Those look a lot like the Black dog mags I have for my .22LR upper. Might have to try one or two of those also.