Biometric work card

[Jumpstart]

I COMPLETELY disagree. Have you ever driven around this state? When I first moved here, I was absolutely AMAZED that you can go for MILES down the highway and see absolutely nothing but empty land.

The more people that are here, the more jobs there are. We are almost entirely a service economy -- and while that's bad, it makes this point all the more apparent.

We need everyone we can get. We need to invest in education for natural born citizens and native Americans alike. This is an investment in the true sense of the word! We put money in, and down the road we get more money out.

Too many people make assumptions that seem logical at first glance when it comes to issues like this.

If you want to make rum runners illegal, make rum legal. Worked then, it works now.

If you want to make border hoppers illegal, make immigration legal.

Illegal immigration/immigration sure is working out well for California isn't it? Economically, culturally and enviromentally. (insert sarcasm) So if we need everyone we can get, shouldn't we be running ships to India, China and Africa and just loading up the country? Imagine what a "cultral melting pot" (insert eye roll and a reminder we aren't in the 19th century any more) utopia we would have here in the USA.(more sarcasm) Illegal aliens and illegal immigration cost the USA multi-millions/billions... after they pay a pittance in taxes. Now U.S. citizens have to get a national id card?
Immigration is legal, so is rum. Get a freakin clue dude.

[theGinsue]

the problem could be easily fixed, but the fix would entail actually punishing those that break the law.... something the government will never do.

Most illegals are good hard working people but that is not the issue. We have the right to decide who comes to our country. Period.

Illegal immigration/immigration sure is working out well for California isn't it? Economically, culturally and enviromentally. (insert sarcasm) So if we need everyone we can get, shouldn't we be running ships to India, China and Africa and just loading up the country? Imagine what a "cultral melting pot" (insert eye roll and a reminder we aren't in the 19th century any more) utopia we would have here in the USA.(more sarcasm) Illegal aliens and illegal immigration cost the USA multi-millions/billions... after they pay a pittance in taxes. Now U.S. citizens have to get a national id card?
Immigration is legal, so is rum. Get a freakin clue dude.

Comment on first quote: Yes!
Comment on second quote: Yes!
Comment on third quote: Nicely stated!

[sniper7]

Illegal immigration/immigration sure is working out well for California isn't it? Economically, culturally and enviromentally. (insert sarcasm) So if we need everyone we can get, shouldn't we be running ships to India, China and Africa and just loading up the country? Imagine what a "cultral melting pot" (insert eye roll and a reminder we aren't in the 19th century any more) utopia we would have here in the USA.(more sarcasm) Illegal aliens and illegal immigration cost the USA multi-millions/billions... after they pay a pittance in taxes. Now U.S. citizens have to get a national id card?
Immigration is legal, so is rum. Get a freakin clue dude.

I call this post hitting the nail on the head

[Pancho Villa]

Millions of kids are born every year - if the country is "already big enough," why not make abortions mandatory?

Millions of poor legal citizens (hey, ever listen to Rush? The bottom 40% of income earners don't really pay taxes anyway) are a net drain on the tax system, use the medical system without "paying in," etc.

Worried about immigrants coming in and voting for a socialist? Better be more worried about the few million high school graduates every year, 'cause the US public education system is a lot better at turning out socialists than crumbling socialist countries.

Here's the deal, guys. If you don't want moochers using up "our" healthcare, "our" roads, etc., stop making them "free." The illusion that all this socialism would work out just fine if only we didn't have illegals around is a joke. Over 150 million people in the US belong to households that don't pay much if any income tax - I would be much more concerned about that than I would be about some mexis border hopping and not paying the $15 in social security that they "should be."

I hear lots of talk of individualism, individual rights, how evil collectivism is, etc, here every day...but all of a sudden it isn't "my" business to do with what I please (like hire cheap mexican labor,) its "our" country? And by extension, "our" business - since you get to tell me what I can and can't do, by virtue of being squirted out in the good ol' US of A? WTF is up with that?

Anyone ever get paid in cash, and not reported the income? (I know I have. For a while it was the only way I could keep a roof over my head and not starve.) Ever sell a rifle and said fuck you IRS, I'm not giving you 30% of the cash I made on this? You've just put yourself in the same tax-avoiding class as some illegals. Its heroic and sticking it to the man or taking back some of the money thats rightfully yours when we do it, but destroying society when some mexican does it? C'mon.

The bottom line is - socialism doesn't work, with or without illegal immigration. The bottom line is - unless there is significant cultural reform, most especially in the school system, we're on a bad road, with or without immigrants coming in. Cali would be down in a hole if they had a fence with tijuana 50 feet high and armed guards every 5 feet. Want to know why?

SOCIALISM DOESN'T WORK!

Don't go pie-in-the-sky socialist and tell me that your socialist utopia of Cali would have worked out swell...if it just weren't for those damn mexicans screwing everything up.

[Beprepared]

OK....so we have laws on the books to address the issues. Why don't we(feds)(cities) enforce them. Here is a different perspective.

1....millions of immigrants use social security and tax Id numbers many are fraudulent (of course many are also legit). For discussion we'll say half real half fake. I have now idea what the real numbers are. So with all these people paying into social security, will they collect retirement? Not as likely. They tax the system elsewhere sure. I believe reason one why the feds ignore this is to extend their ponzi scheme of social security.

2....votes, votes, votes

3....With the exception of China, Latin America, and the U.S. the world is being emigrated by Muslims. Europe and much of the world is being overrun by Muslims. They out breed the rest of the world. Islamic moderates are being pushed out by extremists. Latin American immigrants are Christians that breed.

Food for thought. More on perspective 3 read Mark Steyns bookAmerica Alone

[Jumpstart]

Latin American immigrants are Christians that breed.

Fine. Let them breed, in Latin America. In the meantime, let's start government paid for programs to get U.S. birthrates up on White Christians via economic incentives. How's that for a radical idea?

[Beprepared]

Fine. Let them breed, in Latin America. In the meantime, let's start government paid for programs to get U.S. birthrates up on White Christians via economic incentives. How's that for a radical idea?

I was only stating possible reasons why politicians let it happen. Controlled immigrations is fine. Illegal immigration is not. I agree with your previous statements. Your current statement^^^^^with some perceived racism injected into it ....yea a bit radical.

[Jumpstart]

I was only stating possible reasons why politicians let it happen. Controlled immigrations is fine. Illegal immigration is not. I agree with your previous statements. Your current statement^^^^^with some perceived racism injected into it ....yea a bit radical.

WHy do you think it "racist" if you would indulge me? Ethno-centric perhaps, but racist?

[Hoosier]

The time for us to bring in immigrants isn't over. We need to make it easier for anyone who wants to become a US citizen to make that transition. If we set reasonable standards for entry to make the legal path a viable option, then the number of people coming here illegally would drop. If the number of illegals drops, then DHS has much better chances of actually enforcing the laws. In fact, the only other way to dramatically stem illegal immigration would be for our economy to crater. Even the DMZ has cross border raids launched from it, and it's a fraction the width of our land borders.

Someone made the argument about not all the factories going overseas and it made me want to

Yes, factories have moved to where the cheap labor is. If we could bring in more cheap labor, maybe we could keep more of those factories here. Unless your job is in services, government, or construction it can be outsourced. So you can either ship the work to cheap workers overseas, or at home.

The idea that just "makes sense" isn't always correct. It may "make sense" that keeping out anyone but natural born citizens would translate to more jobs for said citizens, but it simply isn't so.

If you think your special because your parents moved to this country in the distant path, I would respectfully disagree. You have no more right to lay claim to the title "citizen" than anyone else who wants to go through the steps involved. And I think the steps involved should be easier and on a shorter timescale. Those huddled masses will be your customers in a few years, if you let them.

H.

[jake]

So at the moment does an employer have a responsibility to ensure that the person they're hiring isn't an illegal immigrant (I'm talking something more substantial than day labor)?

I have a social security number, which I presume they would want from me if I applied for a job, but I also still have an English accent (so my wife tells me) so would they want to see my certificate of naturalization or my US passport?