-First of all, I'm not defending any illegals at all what so ever. I'm telling you that your ideas are dumb.

-IF all the illegals used resources, the amount would add up to X amount, but they don't and it doesn't. Excellent point. 15% costs (still estimated) of the total possible figure (estimated) sounds like a great reason to re-institute some obscure practice the government practiced for a few months 50 years ago. I guess since my kitchen sink leaks, I'll go ahead and re-plumb my entire house. (my sink doesn't leak by the way).

-I can't pretend that most illegals, personally purchase auto insurance for the vehicles that they drive. However, I also know better than to just assume that all, or even a majority of illegals are getting into auto accidents with any frequency. When was the last time you caused an auto accident? I suppose that I have to assume that people who were born here are automatically better drivers than someone who wasn't born here? I'm going to guess that my personal experience as a claims adjuster handling 1,000s of auto claims over a period of a few years showed me that approx 1 out of 200 claims dealt with an uninsured vehicle, and even less than that with people who were here illegally means anything to anyone, so I won't even bother mentioning that.

-MB888, your rates most likely went up due to the rate adjustments that companies do every single quarter. It's illegal to raise your rates for a not-at-fault accident in this state. My insurance has been going down every six months for the past few years so that I pay over $100 less a month than when I first bought a policy with the company that I'm with now. Who am I supposed to blame that on? Your own driving record and choice of vehicle has a much greater affect on what you pay a month than illegal immigrants could EVER have. Insurance fraud is the major cause of higher rates, not illegal immigrants. Not to mention that there are FAR more uninsured and underinsured Americans cruising the streets than there are illegals.

-You know what other shitty program the government instituted during a major recession? Social security. I guess since we're not in that recession any more then that program worked and we should create more programs just like it right?

-I was born here. There is no where for me to be deported to.

-Way to completely miss the ball on the drug use/putting people in jail issue. How does putting a drug user in jail prevent OTHER PEOPLE from using drugs? It doesn't.

-It's a little bit harder for you to argue with sending illegal Chinese home, because they are white.


-I've looked at some of the links posted and I can't get around all the incomplete info in them. Everything is estimate, and every other sentence is "if this happened..." "If the total is..." if if if if if.

Of course illegals cost us money, of course its a problem. However, you guys are going to have to do a lot better than you are to convince me that it is anywhere near the cost of what we cost ourselves. A simple welfare reform would eliminate any chance of illegals directly receiving welfare benefits. Getting the insurance industry entirely out of the health care industry (well mostly out) would drop health care prices like a rock and would be much more effective than addressing the problem with illegal alien focused solutions. Tighter restrictions on hiring practices and greater punishments for hiring illegals would drastically reduce the amount of illegals being hired. So would repealing stupid laws like the minimum wage. All things that would be significantly more effective than pounding our chests and focusing on deporting people (who will just come right back over) will do.

For about the 200th time. I don't support any illegals. What I also don't support are insanely stupid ideas like "Operation Wetback" as viable solutions to solve our problems.

You guys get so riled up when I tell you that something you've said is a bad idea, that you can't even keep the point of the conversation in focus. You immediately assume that I am trying to protect illegals.

I'll type in bold to increase the chances of this being read and understood.

-Yes we have an immigration problem.
-Yes it costs us more money than if we didn't have the problem (like every other issue in the universe).
-Yes there are ways that we can help eliminate or curb this problem.
-No, ideas like "Operation Wetback" are not viable long term solutions. They are stupid knee-jerk reactions born from misplaced anger.

Spending resources on plans that are centered around deportation is guarantying failure and wasted money. If I have ants on my desk at work, rounding them up and taking them outside will only be a waste of my time if I don't also remove the pile of sugar under my keyboard. In the long run, the benefits of removing the sugar will far outweigh the benefits of taking the ants outside. Even if I never take the ants outside, they'll eventually go find something to eat some where else.

ANTS = ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS
SUGAR = EASILY ACCESSIBLE HAND OUTS DUE TO POORLY WRITTEN LEGISLATION.

Do I need to include pictures next time we go through this?