constititional carry rejected

[hurley842002]

All of you can afford gun(s) but you can't or won't afford $150 for a ccw permit? You all must share with me where you buy your guns.

Blind much? Or you just see what YOU choose to see. Read all the posts before responding please.

And spot on Bailey

[BigMat]

To me, shooting down this was just ruining a good opportunity to fix a non-sensible law.

People who shouldn't carry because they are crooks do anyways, BECAUSE THEY ARE CROOKS.

People who want to carry legally and defend themselves pose NO risk to society beyond risks normally carried by those who operate any legal machinery that can be dangerous (read:cars), so why limit their rights to try to punish those that don't care anyways.



More to the point-
I think the current CCW law is an example of a presumption of guilt. My wife can't legally carry yet because she hasn't proved she is innocent by paying for a backround check. I thought this was not how our justice system was supposed to work?! It should be a presumption of innocence with said rights only removed upon proof of guilt. Keep guns out of violent criminals hands, sure, but there is no sense in punishing the innocent.

[Mazin]

Not to be a stick in the mud but besides the 155 for the ccw you forgot about your quails, most dothe class route and on average its 80-100 more. Just thought I would mention it.

[roberth]

I got news for ya. It's gonna be a long row to hoe to get this passed. And some of the reasons why can be found right on this site:

• "I get nervous when people have a gun and don't know how to use it proficiently."
• "I'd like to see mandatory training before people can carry."
• "People who don't know how to use a gun make me uncomfortable."
• "I want the state to establish training standards."
• "Blah, blah, blah, blah."

But then they bitch because the big, bad government kills this in committee. But then they cheer because some untrained girl ventilates a bad guy with her pink .38 (I know it wasn't a CCW scenario but it's an example of effective self defense by a nominally trained person).

If having the average Joe defend himself is such a problem why aren't we reading about it in the news on a continual basis? Why isn't there story after story of these untrained, armed individuals from VT, AK, AZ and WY creating havoc with their guns everywhere they go? And you're living in a dream world if you think the media just isn't reporting it. They'd be all over that like white on rice.

So many here...on a freakin' hard core gun forum...bitch about the government taking away their rights with one breath but advocating more government control in the next.

It just pisses me off to no end to hear that kind of crap. For the life of me I don't get it. There's absolutely no evidence - other than extremely isolated incidents - that minimal or no training = a danger to society if said untrained person carries a gun for self defense. None. As a matter of fact, the opposite is more true.

Time after time we read about untrained/minimally trained people effectively defending themselves with guns against hardened criminals. Rarely do we read about the same person harming an innocent person with their gun.

A bunch of you guys are gonna be crying big tears when you get what you asked for. If we continue like we are the state WILL set minimum training standards that YOU can't meet. Then you're gonna bitch about that, too.

Fuckin' drives me crazy.

Thank you.

I should be able to open carry or conceal carry anytime I want without paying for a permit. I should be able to carry a long gun if I want as well. It is my right as a law abiding citizen.

The government has gone too far and too long without being challenged.

[clublights]

I got news for ya. It's gonna be a long row to hoe to get this passed. And some of the reasons why can be found right on this site:

• "I get nervous when people have a gun and don't know how to use it proficiently."
• "I'd like to see mandatory training before people can carry."
• "People who don't know how to use a gun make me uncomfortable."
• "I want the state to establish training standards."
• "Blah, blah, blah, blah."

But then they bitch because the big, bad government kills this in committee. But then they cheer because some untrained girl ventilates a bad guy with her pink .38 (I know it wasn't a CCW scenario but it's an example of effective self defense by a nominally trained person).

If having the average Joe defend himself is such a problem why aren't we reading about it in the news on a continual basis? Why isn't there story after story of these untrained, armed individuals from VT, AK, AZ and WY creating havoc with their guns everywhere they go? And you're living in a dream world if you think the media just isn't reporting it. They'd be all over that like white on rice.

So many here...on a freakin' hard core gun forum...bitch about the government taking away their rights with one breath but advocating more government control in the next.

It just pisses me off to no end to hear that kind of crap. For the life of me I don't get it. There's absolutely no evidence - other than extremely isolated incidents - that minimal or no training = a danger to society if said untrained person carries a gun for self defense. None. As a matter of fact, the opposite is more true.

Time after time we read about untrained/minimally trained people effectively defending themselves with guns against hardened criminals. Rarely do we read about the same person harming an innocent person with their gun.

A bunch of you guys are gonna be crying big tears when you get what you asked for. If we continue like we are the state WILL set minimum training standards that YOU can't meet. Then you're gonna bitch about that, too.

Fuckin' drives me crazy.

**STARTS SLOW CLAP**

Here here !!!! +1 from me.

[alxone]

this not getting past is just a set back (i hope). the only people it really hurts is folks like my pops . he is old , crippled (yes hc plates) and is not in a position to defend himself , let alone attend a cc class . I could give a f*ck about the law i want the old man to carry for his safety and if my mom did not live in baltimore id make her carry too (if think our laws suck try maryland) . There should be an age set where is ok to have a pistol concealed (with no permit) . say anyone over fifty should not only be allowed to but be givin a gun buy the government. Making a 20 something single male jump through a few hoops is fine , but the law really hurts , single women , the elderly and disabled and these are the people who need to carry the most.

so i have a question .
what can we do that will actually help change things . Singing things and sending letters dose not seem to work . so any ideas ?? Maybe open carry day is not such a bad idea .

[TS12000]

I think Bailey hit it on the head, no need to reiterate what he said. I would hope that those that choose to carry under a no permit system would seek training though. Not mandatory, but you would figure a halfway intelligent person that wanted to carry legally would also have the sense that they might need some training in situational awareness, good shoot/bad shoot, etc.

[hurley842002]

Man alxone, your views on CC are so flawed it's not even funny, that is all i'm going to say about it tho, because this is America and you are entitled to your own opinion.

[Bailey Guns]

No arguments about voluntary training. It's a good thing.

[alxone]

Man alxone, your views on CC are so flawed it's not even funny, that is all i'm going to say about it tho, because this is America and you are entitled to your own opinion.

how do you figure ??
just because i choose not to carry but at the same time think that women , elderly , and people who would normally not be able to defend them selves should . how is that flawed . Yes i believe a single 20 something male probably dose not need a gun.
When it comes down to it i really dont care if everyone chooses to carry and hell if they want to the should .
how is that flawed ??
I know a lot of people that have and do carry , i dont think they really need to, but if it make them feel better fine .
the big thing is , our rights should be just that OUR RIGHTS .
So back to my question what can we as a community do to fix the problem .just because it dose no effect me (in the way that i choose not to carry) dose not mean that i wont fight for your rights and the rights of all Americans .