Quote Originally Posted by cheapo
pump or auto, name your poison. The ultimate home defense weapon is a 12 gauge shotgun"
Although I agree that a shotgun can be a very effective home defense gun, I am just not ready to give up my hearing discharging a shotgun in close quarters with no muffs. Other rounds from hand guns or carbines can get the job done without sacrificing your ears.
actually i have found that a short barrel pistol, take my .38 spec. detective for example can be quite hard on the ears also. i think having the barrel so much farther away helps, but yeah, the echos gotta be a killer.

but really now, how concerned with your hearing are you going to be when you are fearing for your life or the lives of others???
and a couple 12ga blasts arnt going to permanantly hurt anything, at least i dont think. im not a hearing expert. but i have shot many guns w/o protection (yeah stupid, you pay on the drive back) even the click of the turn signal hurts.

anyways, easy to use, quite powerful at close range. and its more of a point and shoot, easy to hit or at least skim target at close range even at the waist! yeah, i believe 00 buckshot is 9 pellets at around 30cal each flying pretty darn fast at the muzzle. they'd probably cause more damage than a auto 9mm (also a .30cal i believe, well .38 but isnt that still considered .30cal??) mp5 holding down on 10 shots. the jackets provides more penetration though. which isnt always good anyways, especially in a home! some people think a .22 is more of a toy than anything. worthless for home defense, which most cases they are. but the lack of penetration power can cause it to bounce inside, like between ribs causing extreme internal damage... way more than an extreme round for defense, like a .308

anyways, once again, im my mind theres no beating the 12ga pump. even a cheap one (meaning mossberg) is quite reliable and easy to use.
i had problems with a couple 870s ive had though, amazingly enough. being standard police issue forever youd think it would be better. i had 2 brand new ones, one was just bottom line 18 or 20" and another was the mariner, the nickel plated one. it was quite heavy and screwed up more than the original one! wont buy one of those again, i have had great luck with the beretta 1201fp semi. excellent gun. all interchangeable with benelli parts and same gas system. you have to use at least med loads though, wont cycle the cheapo target $4 box shells. if i had the money and knew where to get one, i would buy another, favorite shotgun of all time. light recoil, rifle sights, and it worked flawlessly!!! anyways im bored and i like to talk about guns. sorry about the long ass post