Obama Immigration Speech

[ChunkyMonkey]

And while I'm not a huge fan of Obama, I think our country would still be in the shit shape it is now if McCain and Palin would have been elected,

True.. however, 2nd termer typically has much much more freehand on his (extreme) true agenda.

[Pancho Villa]

Well, it's not like the republican party is bringing out any better choices so far...

And while I'm not a huge fan of Obama, I think our country would still be in the shit shape it is now if McCain and Palin would have been elected, minus health care and some TSA nonsense. It's gonna take a hell of a lot more than just a non-dem in the white house to make a real difference in this country....

I voted for Obama, PRIMARILY because it was my judgement that a McCain presidency would see:

1. Massive bailouts for banks
2. Healthcare reform just mildly less onerous than Obamacare, with the private-insurance-killing "cover preexisting conditions" clause still there
3. Billions of dollars given to foreign countries to apologize for the US being the US

...and if that was gonna happen, I'd rather someone who stands pretty openly for Statism, rather than someone masquerading as a free market guy, be the one doing it.

At least now its a harder argument to say "the free market has failed! We need a candidate who is more big government!" I mean, they are still going to say it (the bailouts weren't big enough! We need a single payer system!) but its definitely easier to say "you were trying statist things to begin with, don't blame the free market."

I'll probably just abstain in disgust if the GOP puts out Palin, Romney, or some other statist idiot. I don't know if the country can take another 4 years of Obama, but I doubt it can take 4 years of Sarah "windfall profit taxes on oil companies are, like, totally free market" Palin or Mitt "Socialist Healthcare is Cool if a Republican Does it" Romney, or one of their many imitators, either.

We need a real free market + individual liberty person, not some politician who talks a big game but will jump on statist measures at the first opportunity.

[sneakerd]

"What's wrong with virtually open borders"? You've got to be kidding me.

[Pancho Villa]

What's wrong with "virtually open borders"? You've got to be kidding me.

Waiting for what's wrong with handing visas to all non-violent, non-terrorist individuals who won't draw welfare...

[sneakerd]

Huh?

[Pancho Villa]

Huh?

When I say "virtually open borders" those are the conditions I mean. A green card to anyone who wants to work here, won't collect welfare, has no violent record and no attachment to terrorist orgs.

And a (long) path to citizenship for those who want to become a citizen.

[sneakerd]

Ok fine- I have no issue with any of that- but that is a border controlled and regulated. That's what we need, from the Gulf of Mexico to the Pacific ocean.

[Pancho Villa]

Ok fine- I have no issue with any of that- but that is a border controlled and regulated. That's what we need, from the Gulf of Mexico to the Pacific ocean.

My personal opinion is that the need for border enforcement will drop drastically if that was implemented, but hey, we can wait and see.

[sneakerd]

Not initially- since the border will need to be CLOSED during implementation. Of course this is all just wishful thinking- since none of this will ever happen. Nobody on either side has the balls to do it, and the Dems will never get on board with ANY serious controls. That's why it is all just talk.

[Pancho Villa]

Not initially- since the border will need to be CLOSED during implementation. Of course this is all just wishful thinking- since none of this will ever happen. Nobody on either side has the balls to do it, and the Dems will never get on board with ANY serious controls. That's why it is all just talk.

I'm curious as to what you mean by "closed."

I think simply opening up the legal option will get the vast majority to stop hopping the fence, not necessitating any sort of step-up in border control. Why would you need to "close" the border?