Patriot Act For/Against?

[Ranger]

I'm interested in the general opinions here. I've been reading a lot lately about gross violations of this and wonder where the assumed supporters of this act, the right - who seem to dominate this board - sit on the topic.

[DeusExMachina]

It is a heinous crime against the constitution.

[BlasterBob]

The original idea was OK but then the Fed's apparently wanted a lot of things that made most of us hope that it would go belly up before it trampled on so many of our rights.

[Ronin13]

"Those who will sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither." -Benjamin Franklin.
I hated how they could justify it with all the rhetoric "...or the terrorists win." The average American is scared s***less, they've already won- hence why they're called TERRORists... Remove fear and you take away the power of the enemy.

[stevelkinevil]

This is an abomination, and it goes against everything this nation was intended to be by our founding fathers. The fact that it gets such broad by-partisan support should scare folks a hell of alot more than any terrorist.

[TS12000]

I really hope those three yes votes are trolling.

[Bailey Guns]

I voted "Against" since this is an all or nothing question.

However, I have to say there are some things in the law that I agree with. For example, the provision that requires phone solicitors that call on behalf of charities to provide certain information regarding their operation including an address, etc... Or the provision that makes it a crime to basically impersonate a member of the Red Cross.

I've tried to read the entire Act. OK...so I can read the whole thing. I can hardly understand everything that it entails. I've read some commentaries from intelligent people who are on both sides of the act and even they say they can't make enough sense out of all the provisions in the Act to truly form an opinion as to whether it's a completely good or bad thing.

So, generally, I'd say I'm more against it than for it. Especially the NSLs...though the NSL provisions have mostly been stricken down by the courts as unconstitutional anyway...so it's kind of a moot point. I know it's generally made opening a bank account a real pain in the ass.

But even the ACLU, probably the most outspoken critic of the Act, has only challenged certain provisions of the Act even though they talk about how bad the entire thing is.

Personally, I think a lot of the rhetoric, both for and against, is way overblown.

[Elhuero]

we let the terrorists win if we abridge our freedoms because of their actions.

we need to be as free as possible, and when we find a terrorist deal with them in the harshest manner possible.

just so everyone understands my definition of "harsh", when a suicide bomber attacks troops in afghanistan, we id them then delete their whole family.

everyone related to them joins them in martyrdom. the families of the 19 hijackers? uh huh, I went there.

I agree with bailey, there are parts of it that are worth keeping, but I voted no.

one of the things that bush did after 9/11 was to create a new agency, I think that's the last bloody thing we needed. we need to shut half the government down, now, or we'll end up worse than greece.

[Byte Stryke]

"Those who will sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither." -Benjamin Franklin.

this

[blacklabel]

The fact that it gets such broad by-partisan support should scare folks a hell of alot more than any terrorist.

Doesn't matter what side of the aisle the politician is on, they're still a politician that wants nothing but more power.

The Patriot Act is just the tip of the iceberg in my opinion.