"No Knock Raid"

[bryjcom]

You are right! Now, can you tell me what forces the states to comply with the Constitution?

And Bryan, read our own state Constitution. It mentions something about not being able to carry concealed...Interesting stuff!

My statement was in response to your response to a different statement that the 4th amendment protects us against unreasonable search and seizure. Your statement basically says that the 4th doesn't apply to non federal LEOs and then you turn around and say that we are right???

You aren't making sense.

I don't understand why you think 10s of thousands of No Knock Raids are somehow justified??? The last figure I saw was 50,000 No Knocks were conducted in 2005. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-knock_warrant

Your telling me that out of those 50,000, all of them were justified and none of them were unreasonable and were excessive force??

[bryjcom]

Before for this thread gets closed I wanted to say, poor dogs. How many did they kill in that video?

I hope it doesn't get closed. We are all having a respectful debate were we are respectfully disagreeing with each other.

Everyone needs to remember to disagree respectfully

[Byte Stryke]

Before for this thread gets closed I wanted to say, poor dogs. How many did they kill in that video?

That's state business and none of yours. Unless you want to go down for interfering with a police officer I Suggest you shut ___ ____ up, mind your business and pay your taxes, subject!


/Sarcasm, I wish

[jerrymrc]

I hope it doesn't get closed. We are all having a respectful debate were we are respectfully disagreeing with each other.

Everyone needs to remember to disagree respectfully

I hope so. It is on the edge right now.

Raise your hand if you have ever done OPFOR training and had a flashbang go off near you...
Same building....

Same room...

what could you hear afterwards?

Nothing but ringing. Same deal as an artillery simulator 20' away at night. the flash leaves one blind for about 10 min.

[Byte Stryke]

Nothing but ringing. Same deal as an artillery simulator 20' away at night. the flash leaves one blind for about 10 min.

Now imagine its 0330 and a bunch of figures are yelling something while storming your house.

my entire argument is that the tactic off storming a house will cause a Fight/Flight response of anyone in the house, regardless of innocence or guilt...
But the Legal system Then asserts that any response is a sign of guilt...

even contesting the no knock raid has triggered a defensive/aggressive response in some.

[bryjcom]

Now imagine its 0330 and a bunch of figures are yelling something while storming your house.

my entire argument is that the tactic off storming a house will cause a Fight/Flight response of anyone in the house, regardless of innocence or guilt...
But the Legal system Then asserts that any response is a sign of guilt...

even contesting the no knock raid has triggered a defensive/aggressive response in some.

Thats a very good point.

Even if they don't use a flash bang, the fact is, when you are abruptly woken up not every part of your brain is awake. Even if you hear "Police!!! Search Warrant!!" your brain may not process it and the primitive part of your brain will take over which often consists of self preservation.

Do you know how many times I have had my kids wake me up from a deep sleep and it takes about 30 seconds for me to figure out what the heck is going on??

[Byte Stryke]

Thats a very good point.

Even if they don't use a flash bang, the fact is, when you are abruptly woken up not every part of your brain is awake. Even if you hear "Police!!! Search Warrant!!" your brain may not process it and the primitive part of your brain will take over which often consists of self preservation.

Do you know how many times I have had my kids wake me up from a deep sleep and it takes about 30 seconds for me to figure out what the heck is going on??

exactly... but in that 30 seconds your room quickly fills with strangers in black yelling.

[cstone]

LE is a great occupation for those who are suited. I highly recommend it.

Many departments and agencies are taking applications.

Walk a mile in my shoes and we can have a discussion about common experiences. Otherwise some of us are discussing what we have read and how we feel, and others are sharing their real life experiences.

Any one here ever had a "No Knock" warrant served on them? Anyone here ever lived next to someone who had a "No Knock" warrant served on them? I don't know where the 50,000 "No Knock" warrants each year number comes from, but it doesn't sound right to me, but I admit I don't really keep track of such things as it is something I do not have much experience with either as the recipient or server.

What a great country where we can debate with such passion, yet still share our common love of firearms. For those who serve the republic in any fashion, thank you for your service. I hope everyone is enjoying the fantastic weather. Just got back from Pawnee and the shooting was good

[Clint45]

I execute a number of search warrants over the course of a year and most all are done by knocking. When I get the occasional one that requires a higher level of response due to the person's history, behavior, or bravado speech, then we will talk about using a trained tactical team, potential risk issues, and conduct a risk assessment. There isn't a time in my nearly 20 years as a cop where I have gotten a no-knock warrant. Even for 1st degree murder charges. They are simply too hard to get here in Colorado without a lot of substaniating supportive documentation. I have done a number of high risk warrants (knock and announce and after an appropriate amount of time, booted the door) without anyone being injured, both good and bad guy, and without shooring the dog. Some crimes are inherently more risky to the officers involved, and a level of safety must be met for the sake of the officers.

I am very glad to hear this. Thank you.

There ARE places in other states where judges will rubber stamp a warrant based solely upon a policeman saying that a CI told him the man at that house was committing crimes. There are other places where a policeman will kick in a door without a warrant. I am glad that here in Colorado the police are held to a higher standard. That is as it should be. If you have a search warrant bang on the door for a while before kicking it in. Give them an opportunity to answer the door. Maybe they need to get dressed first. I never want to hear some cop say that he kicked in a door because he thought the person inside might flush something down the toilet.