When is it ok to use your CCL and do you HAVE to shoot?

[Artyboy]

I've been looking over the laws on the CBI website and I just want to confirm a few things.

18-12-106. Prohibited use of weapons.

(1) A person commits a class 2 misdemeanor if:

(a) He knowingly and unlawfully aims a firearm at another person; or

(b) Recklessly or with criminal negligence he discharges a firearm or shoots a bow and arrow; or

(c) He knowingly sets a loaded gun, trap, or device designed to cause an explosion upon being tripped or approached, and leaves it unattended by a competent person immediately present; or

(d) The person has in his or her possession a firearm while the person is under the influence of intoxicating liquor or of a controlled substance, as defined in section 12-22-303 (7), C.R.S. Possession of a permit issued under section 18-12-105.1, as it existed prior to its repeal, or possession of a permit or a temporary emergency permit issued pursuant to part 2 of this article is no defense to a violation of this subsection (1).

(e) He knowingly aims, swings, or throws a throwing star or nunchaku as defined in this paragraph (e) at another person, or he knowingly possesses a throwing star or nunchaku in a public place except for the purpose of presenting an authorized public demonstration or exhibition or pursuant to instruction in conjunction with an organized school or class. When transporting throwing stars or nunchaku for a public demonstration or exhibition or for a school or class, they shall be transported in a closed, nonaccessible container. For purposes of this paragraph (e), "nunchaku" means an instrument consisting of two sticks, clubs, bars, or rods to be used as handles, connected by a rope, cord, wire, or chain, which is in the design of a weapon used in connection with the practice of a system of self-defense, and "throwing star" means a disk having sharp radiating points or any disk-shaped bladed object which is hand-held and thrown and which is in the design of a weapon used in connection with the practice of a system of self-defense.

Source: L. 71: R&RE, p. 482, § 1. C.R.S. 1963: § 40-12-106. L. 77: (1)(a) and (1)(c) amended, p. 971, § 63, effective July 1. L. 81: (1)(d) amended, p. 738, § 25, effective July 1. L. 82: (1)(d) amended, p. 623, § 18, effective April 2. L. 84: (1)(e) added, p. 539, § 17, effective July 1. L. 2003: (1)(d) amended, p. 649, § 5, effective May 17.

Editor's note: Section 11 of chapter 44, Session Laws of Colorado 2003, provides that the act amending subsection (1)(d) applies to offenses committed on or after May 17, 2003.

ANNOTATION

Am. Jur.2d. See 79 Am. Jur.2d, Weapons and Firearms, § 30.

C.J.S. See 94 C.J.S., Weapons, §§ 37, 43.

This section is neither unconstitutionally overbroad nor unconstitutionally vague. People v. Garcia, 197 Colo. 550, 595 P.2d 228 (1979).

Right to bear arms is not absolute, and it can be restricted by the state's valid exercise of its police power. People v. Garcia, 197 Colo. 550, 595 P.2d 228 (1979).

Common sense definition of "possession", as it is used in subsection (1)(d) is the actual or physical control of a firearm. People v. Garcia, 197 Colo. 550, 595 P.2d 228 (1979).

Failure to define "under the influence of intoxicating liquor", if error, was harmless, where defendant, charged with violation of this section, testified that he was too drunk to drive. People v. Beckett, 782 P.2d 812 (Colo. App. 1989), aff'd, 800 P.2d 74 (Colo. 1990).

Possession of a firearm while intoxicated is a strict liability offense, therefore, the trial court did not err in refusing to instruct the jury that "knowingly" was an element of the offense. People v. Wilson, 972 P.2d 701 (Colo. App. 1998).

Self defense is not a valid defense to the crime of prohibited use of weapons. People v. Beckett, 782 P.2d 812 (Colo. App. 1989), aff'd, 800 P.2d 74 (Colo. 1990).

Applied in People v. McPherson, 200 Colo. 429, 619 P.2d 38 (1980).

If I feel threatened and I show my gun am I committing a crime? I realize that you shouldn't draw your gun unless you feel like you're in danger and you intend to shoot the person. Realistically, though, there are a lot of situations that could be quickly diffused as soon as you introduce your firearm into the equation.

Let's say someone is breaking into my car and I catch them in the act. I yell at them and put my hand on my gun. They immediately realize that I'm armed and run away. As long as I don't point the gun at anyone then I'm doing nothing wrong correct? Can they get you for brandishing if you don't point the gun at anyone?

18-12-214. Authority granted by permit - carrying restrictions.

(1) (a) A permit to carry a concealed handgun authorizes the permittee to carry a concealed handgun in all areas of the state, except as specifically limited in this section. A permit does not authorize the permittee to use a handgun in a manner that would violate a provision of state law. A local government does not have authority to adopt or enforce an ordinance or resolution that would conflict with any provision of this part 2.

(b) A peace officer may temporarily disarm a permittee, incident to a lawful stop of the permittee. The peace officer shall return the handgun to the permittee prior to discharging the permittee from the scene.

(2) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law.

(3) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvements erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school; except that:

(a) A permittee may have a handgun on the real property of the public school so long as the handgun remains in his or her vehicle and, if the permittee is not in the vehicle, the handgun is in a compartment within the vehicle and the vehicle is locked.

(b) A permittee who is employed or retained by contract by a school district as a school security officer may carry a concealed handgun onto the real property, or into any improvement erected thereon, of a public elementary, middle, junior high, or high school while the permittee is on duty.

(c) A permittee may carry a concealed handgun on undeveloped real property owned by a school district that is used for hunting or other shooting sports.

(4) A permit issued pursuant to this part 2 does not authorize a person to carry a concealed handgun into a public building at which:

(a) Security personnel and electronic weapons screening devices are permanently in place at each entrance to the building;

(b) Security personnel electronically screen each person who enters the building to determine whether the person is carrying a weapon of any kind; and

(c) Security personnel require each person who is carrying a weapon of any kind to leave the weapon in possession of security personnel while the person is in the building.

(5) Nothing in this part 2 shall be construed to limit, restrict, or prohibit in any manner the existing rights of a private property owner, private tenant, private employer, or private business entity.

(6) The provisions of this section apply to temporary emergency permits issued pursuant to section 18-12-209.

Source: L. 2003: Entire part added, p. 647, § 1, effective May 17.

The only places where we're not allowed to carry are in public schools and public buildings where they screen everyone coming in, am I right? Signs mean nothing. Are there any other places where I can't carry? Are there differant rules for carrying in national and state parks?

[KarlPMann]

Well, brandishing is a bad grey area to some. I've been told and warned that just displaying a firearm can lead to lawsuits at times, but rarely would lead to criminal prosecution. As for "putting your hand on it" when approaching a would be car thief, that could be touchy in some cities. Personally I think I'd be likely to do whatever I wanted if the car were in my front driveway, but less likely if it were parked at the mall or such.

As for carrying it, like you said, if they don't screen for weapons and it isn't prohibited specifically by law, then the sign means nothing. Karl.

[Artyboy]

Well, brandishing is a bad grey area to some. I've been told and warned that just displaying a firearm can lead to lawsuits at times, but rarely would lead to criminal prosecution. As for "putting your hand on it" when approaching a would be car thief, that could be touchy in some cities. Personally I think I'd be likely to do whatever I wanted if the car were in my front driveway, but less likely if it were parked at the mall or such.

As for carrying it, like you said, if they don't screen for weapons and it isn't prohibited specifically by law, then the sign means nothing. Karl.

Is there a law that I missed somewhere that specifically states that you can't "flash" your gun or draw it without pointing it at someone? Maybe there's a federal law or something...... I would think that the feds would leave something like that up to the state, though. I understand that it could lead to civil prosecution. People can sue you for anything and win these days, though :roll:. I'm more worried about the criminal aspects. If someone threatens me enough that I feel the need to put my hand on my gun then I'll worry about them suing me later. I'm MUCH more worried about going to jail or losing my rights. Thanks for the info so far.

[HunterCO]

Is there a law that I missed somewhere that specifically states that you can't "flash" your gun or draw it without pointing it at someone?

Yes it's called menacing and if a deadly weapon is involved it is a felony in the state of CO.

Let’s make it simple unless you have REASON to believe your life or another’s is in immediate danger of serious bodily injury or death your gun best stay where it is.

[MPfiveengineer]

I am guilty of this. Back when I wan in college in Texas I worked part time at Circuit City for a while. Anyway, one night after getting home from work at 10:30pm and I decided I wanted to wash my car so I went to the coin wash. While I was washing my car I noticed two Hispanic guys casing the stall I was in by walking back and forth. I had a feeling they were about to try something so I "accidentally" lifted up the back of my shirt by extending over my car revealing my Glock 23 in my SOB holster. I made sure by back was pointed directly at them the next time they walked by. I firmly believe to this day that if I had not done that I would have had to use my gun that night.

[HunterCO]

I am guilty of this. Back when I wan in college in Texas I worked part time at Circuit City for a while. Anyway, one night after getting home from work at 10:30pm and I decided I wanted to wash my car so I went to the coin wash. While I was washing my car I noticed two Hispanic guys casing the stall I was in by walking back and forth. I had a feeling they were about to try something so I "accidentally" lifted up the back of my shirt by extending over my car revealing my Glock 23 in my SOB holster. I made sure by back was pointed directly at them the next time they walked by. I firmly believe to this day that if I had not done that I would have had to use my gun that night.

Ken that is what I am talking about you felt threatend and that is fine you did not break any law. I am saying that if you did that out of spite to say hey I am a bada$$ then your in serious trouble.

[roman gnome]

My thoughts too, those two guys had no intention of calling the police to say the felt intimidated.

[MPfiveengineer]

Good to know, I was told by a cop friend when I told him that story that what I had done was illegal. How about this one. When I got my first apartment in college my parking space was about 10 feet away from my front door. About 3:00am one morning my alarm went off and I dashed out the door with the nearest thing I could grab. When I opened the door I found three guys standing around my Jeep (unfortunately again they were Hispanic). They all bolted (maybe it was because I was wearing a pair of boxers and an AK47) I chased them for two blocks. What would be the legality on that one? Being a little older, wiser, and a little heavier I would not have chased them now. I was 19 at the time.

[HunterCO]

Good to know, I was told by a cop friend when I told him that story that what I had done was illegal. How about this one. When I got my first apartment in college my parking space was about 10 feet away from my front door. About 3:00am one morning my alarm went off and I dashed out the door with the nearest thing I could grab. When I opened the door I found three guys standing around my Jeep (unfortunately again they were Hispanic). They all bolted (maybe it was because I was wearing a pair of boxers and an AK47) I chased them for two blocks. What would be the legality on that one? Being a little older, wiser, and a little heavier I would not have chased them now. I was 19 at the time.

Don't chase that could have got you in a lot of trouble. unless it's covert [wink]

[Artyboy]

See that's the thing. There's a differance between what's right and wrong and what is legal. I carry my gun in case I need to defend myself. I don't do it to act tough. I sure as HELL don't tell people about it. I just feel like there are times when showing someone that you're armed is enough. Naturally, you can't do it expecting that to be enough. You still have to be ready to use it.

Let's take the example above where you're at the car wash in the middle of the night and a couple of goons come along and act suspicious. Those two didn't do anything but we all know that they were probably planning on doing something. Had they decided to go to the police and say that someone just flashed a gun at them could they arrest you and what kind of trouble could you be in? What laws would they use to prosecute you?

I suppose I just want to know exactly how the law works so that I don't get screwed. Not all laws follow the line of common sense thinking. Just because it seems to me like it's a situation that warrants protecting myself doesn't mean that the law will.