My New Avatar

[GearHead]

American Muscle Forever!
Import suck.
I was sick last week and couldn't engage the Domestic vs Import debate but I'm ready now.. Bring it!

[TheSparkens]

Without question, the only muscle is American muscle every thing else is just freaking rice. [poke]

[HunterCO]

I don't think there was any debate over USA muscle it was rather daily drivers the car to get you to and from work. In a daily driver Asian cars win hands down.

Now if you’re talking horse power obviously nothing can touch American muscle. My 73 firebird with a 454 BB chevy full interior and glass 3800 lbs. runs high 11's in the quarter at bandi. Its street legal I use to run tower road, monaco, in longmont ran woodland and the dog pound had a great time.

I am getting to be an old bastage and would not ever think of street racing again plus it is different now. Back in the day I lived to street race but we were smart about it and people had some serious hardware. Now it's just jackass kids with slow cars killing people. Hell tower road the cops would come and watch it was a great time.

I can assure you I am not knocking American Muscle but when it comes to a daily driver no American car can ever compete.

[GearHead]

Ok, let's talk daily drivers. (cause I'll take my 68 Cam over any civic)
True the US big three stepped on their own stick. Quality dropped and prices when up. Started in the 70s. But, all three have greatly improved on quality and can compete with the foreign manufactures today.

I say support our US companies to help them become stronger. They won’t make the same mistakes as in the past.

Argument: But my Toyota was made in Fremont CA. So what? 64% of all foreign cars sold in the US were assembled in the US. Nice, thank you foreign regimes. But, all the parts were manufactured abroad. Plus the profits from cars sold benefit foreign interest.

Argument: My Focus was assembled in Mexico. This is the exception, not the rule. Vettes are still manufactured in Bowling Green, KY and F150 are still made in Detroit. Your US dollar is not staying in Mexico, if it were, we wouldn’t be having an immigration problem.

Argument: But the US parts are manufactured abroad. Not all. And the major portion of the dollar you spend STAYS in the US, compared to an import.

Yes the lines are blurry. Yes, imports have their advantages. But, so do US made vehicles. For example, parts aren’t as expensive.

The number one thing that bugs me about the big three is; they have a large stake in the oil industry. This is a conflict of interest. Why does my 02 F150 get the same gas mileage as an 86 F150? No incentive to improve. The foreign competition will change this too. Even the JAMA (Japan Auto Manufacturing Assoc) companies could be doing better here. Take a look at their Hybrids. 40mpg? That’s it? Look at the Hybrid clubs and their successful modifications to increase fuel efficiencies to 60+. Don’t tell me that these large corporations don’t have these technologies.

[JasonFRC]

Not to start a flame war here, but the comments above are just silly.

American muscle has it's place, but there is also a place for 700 horsepower 4 bangers too.

http://www.rmdsm.org/forums/showthre...1&page=2&pp=10

That's my brother. It's a 1990 Eagle Talon. It's a 2.3 liter with a big turbo on it. He uses E85 too. Full interior, 3300 lbs. All wheel drive.

Myself? I'd LOVE to have an old Camaro, but I've done the Import thing too. I own a '99 Corvette now. They're all cool in their own way. Fast is fast.

All I can say for daily drivers... Buy what makes you happy. If it's a VW Jetta, so be it. Every car has it's drawbacks, and faults. I currently drive a '98 Volvo V70XC. You want to talk about a car that will nickel and dime you to death! That's my business, I repair Volvos. When someone wants reliability, I recommend Honda, not Volvo. Cars are so Global now, most companies are so Multi-National, it's difficult to dicern where their interests lie. Volvos have a TON of Japanese parts now, as well as a transmission designed by GM. Volvo's P2 chassis is shared by Mazda, Ford, Land Rover. How's that for confusing?

[GearHead]

Yep, you can get 700hp from a 4banner. At 4 or 5 times the cost as a small block V8 and that will only go down the track 4 - 5 times before you need to rebuild. I can do the same thing with a Cavalier or Focus. But com-on, really, you would take a 700hp Talon over a 67 Stingray, 65 Goat, 68 Roadrunner, 67 GT Mustang? Really? (youth today :roll: )

Daily drivers, yep the crossbreeding has made the lines blurry, and each has their pros & cons. My point is to support the US Auto Industry. Hey, I'm opened minded.. Convince me to buy an import. (my wife did it. she bought a Kia)

Oh, one more thing, it was interesting that your example was a Talon. An American car company designed and built by a Japanese company.

[Hoser]

Yeah. Well. My 2004 Bug gets almost 50 MPG and you would never expect it to be full of guns. Pot or coke maybe, but not guns.

And the heated seats are nice...

So there.

[westy1970]

I have the best of both worlds. Mazda B3000. Foreign Company uses Ford Parts and assembles in the US. V6 motor with 20+ if I am careful with the throttle.

[GearHead]

Yeah. Well. My 2004 Bug gets almost 50 MPG and you would never expect it to be full of guns. Pot or coke maybe, but not guns.

uuummm got me, I just don't were to start on what's wrong with that theory

[JasonFRC]

Yep, you can get 700hp from a 4banner. At 4 or 5 times the cost as a small block V8 and that will only go down the track 4 - 5 times before you need to rebuild. I can do the same thing with a Cavalier or Focus. But com-on, really, you would take a 700hp Talon over a 67 Stingray, 65 Goat, 68 Roadrunner, 67 GT Mustang? Really? (youth today :roll: )

Daily drivers, yep the crossbreeding has made the lines blurry, and each has their pros & cons. My point is to support the US Auto Industry. Hey, I'm opened minded.. Convince me to buy an import. (my wife did it. she bought a Kia)

Oh, one more thing, it was interesting that your example was a Talon. An American car company designed and built by a Japanese company.

I see where you're going with this. Apples and oranges. You're talking about two distinctly different types of cars. Are the classic cars you mentioned cooler? Well, maybe to some. Would my brother trade that Talon for a '67 Stingray? Well of course he would.

I think you need to give credit where credit is due. Today's youth didn't grow up with Roadrunners, Chevelles, and the like. You did. Why disrespect others for what they like? By the way, the only reason my brother's car gets taken apart is because he can't find drivetrain parts to support the engine. It's still a fairly new niche, and you can't just bolt a powerglide onto a transverse mounted engine with all wheel drive.

Cost isn't a compairison point either. My brother has less than 15k into his car. When's the last time you saw any of those vehicles you mentioned built, and fast (10 second timeslips) for less than 15k? I'd gather never. But! My brother's car is old, paint coming off, interior plastic disintegrating... So there you go. It's not much to look at, but it's fast as snot.

So what you ask? Exactly. So what. Fast is fast. A classic car is just that. Classic. They each have their own followings, and to argue better or worse is a waste of time. Did I mention my brother and I grew up around Corvettes and Ford Model A's? We know what beautiful classic cars are. Most "kids" do too.

Diamond Star Motors was a joint venture between Chrysler Corp, and Mitsubishi. The assembly plant was in Normal, Illinois. The Eclipse/Talon platform was designed specifically for the American market. Sometime in the late 90's Chrysler sold the plant back to Mitsubishi.