Tankless Water Heater Install

[Bailey Guns]

I wanted to revive this thread with an update after using the tankless for a winter season.

We encountered only one problem having the tankless heater and it wasn't really related to the unit at all. Thanksgiving saw heavy use of the kitchen propane-fired stove/oven a lot in conjunction with the Rheem propane water heater. The Rheem unit requires a LOT of propane to fire the 155k BTU burner. The kitchen stove seemed to never really get to the desired heat setting and the turkey came out a bit undercooked. After some thought I figured out why...we were using a lot of hot water in the kitchen and the stove/oven were in heavy use. Apparently the oven was being starved of propane and never reached the correct temp as a result. Next time, we'll know how to compensate for the heavy use. Other than that, no real issues.

But there are definitely pros/cons to the tankless system:

Pros:

• They are more efficient at providing hot water in terms of energy use when used properly.
• You'll don't run out of hot water.
• Very small...takes up little room whether inside or out.
• Relatively inexpensive compared to most of the better tank models.

Cons:

• You really have to change some habits...like a quick hand-washing. Firing up the 155k burner for just a minute or so several times throughout the day will use more propane than a standard water heater.
• Seems to take a little longer to get hot water to the faucet.
• With cold well water (our's averaged about 41 degrees during the cold months) the water will only get so hot...probably about 104 degrees, give or take a degree. Plenty comfortable for a shower. But the water doesn't get sufficiently hot for washing some dishes that can't go into the dishwasher. We use a lot of cast iron and other non-dishwasher safe pans and such for cooking. Wife likes a very hot rinse for them which doesn't happen with this unit.

All in all I'm pretty satisfied and cab live with a tankless heater. The wife prefers a standard tank-type unit. But the bottom line is they will work and provide hot water, even in the higher and colder elevations (we're at about 8200 ft). I might be a bit more hesitant if I had a bigger house...or at least look into a bigger unit with stronger capabilities.

[10mm-man]

Cons:

• You really have to change some habits...like a quick hand-washing. Firing up the 155k burner for just a minute or so several times throughout the day will use more propane than a standard water heater.
• Seems to take a little longer to get hot water to the faucet.
• With cold well water (our's averaged about 41 degrees during the cold months) the water will only get so hot...probably about 104 degrees, give or take a degree. Plenty comfortable for a shower. But the water doesn't get sufficiently hot for washing some dishes that can't go into the dishwasher. We use a lot of cast iron and other non-dishwasher safe pans and such for cooking. Wife likes a very hot rinse for them which doesn't happen with this unit.

All in all I'm pretty satisfied and cab live with a tankless heater. The wife prefers a standard tank-type unit. But the bottom line is they will work and provide hot water, even in the higher and colder elevations (we're at about 8200 ft). I might be a bit more hesitant if I had a bigger house...or at least look into a bigger unit with stronger capabilities.

Have you thought about running an under counter water heater- Insta hot? Not sure what they cost but this would prob solve that issue or the issues above.

[Bailey Guns]

Not really. I've heard of people doing that but it's not to the point where we've decided to do it.

[10mm-man]

Not really. I've heard of people doing that but it's not to the point where we've decided to do it.

http://www.amazon.com/s/?ie=UTF8&key...l_5wshsepjf9_b

[Lurch]

Thanks for the info. I have always wondered about those and how well they did with cold well water.

[whitbaby]

Jealous as well, it's just my wife my son and I so I've been told that a regular 50 gal tank is enough. For large families it's worth it...

Keep us updated on who you use, my house is nearing 11 years and will need to look at replacing appliances

Hope the son isn't a typical teenager...they'll stay in the shower until ALL the hot water is gone! ... ALL OF IT!

[Ah Pook]

Thanks for the update.

Nothing I didn't expect except for the propane usage problem.

[MarkCO]

I've done 3 fires caused by standard water heaters, and a dozen caused by Tankless. When you run the math, in most cases, they are not worth the trouble. A good commercial high efficiency water heater will cost more, but the fuel costs will be less in the long run. For an average family in a normal sized home, a 90% to 96% efficient tank commercial grade water heater will cost the least over it's lifetime. I have an AOSmith Vertex (only HE choice when we built the house) and we never run out of hot water, but there are now others on the market as well. I have about 50 failed water heaters in my shop at any one time, so I see a lot of them.

You do NOT want your water heater set less than about 120F. Read up on Legionnaires disease before you go telling people to turn their water heaters down to 100F.

[Gman]

I picked up a standard GE branded high efficiency water heater made by Rheem at Home Depot a couple of years ago. It was amazing to see how much larger the same tank size was with all of the extra insulation around the tank. My gas bill noticeably dropped and we have lots of hot water without the trade-offs.

If your fuel source is propane, it would be interesting to see what the overall costs are for a tankless vs. standard .

[dodgefreak8]

I've done 3 fires caused by standard water heaters, and a dozen caused by Tankless. When you run the math, in most cases, they are not worth the trouble. A good commercial high efficiency water heater will cost more, but the fuel costs will be less in the long run. For an average family in a normal sized home, a 90% to 96% efficient tank commercial grade water heater will cost the least over it's lifetime. I have an AOSmith Vertex (only HE choice when we built the house) and we never run out of hot water, but there are now others on the market as well. I have about 50 failed water heaters in my shop at any one time, so I see a lot of them.

You do NOT want your water heater set less than about 120F. Read up on Legionnaires disease before you go telling people to turn their water heaters down to 100F.

Legionnaires isn't "generally" considered a threat in a domestic drinking supply. It is more prevalent in situations such as cooling towers etc where open atmosphere is in contact with recycled water. If you are worried about legionnaires than simply adding cold water to the 120* hot water in a standard system to make 102* water would be just a much a threat to getting the disease.

Tankless water heaters are designed to run at temps around 105*. That is where the energy savings come from and the fact that you aren't maintaining 50 gals of water while not in use. The downsides to tankless are 1) you rarely recoup your installation costs in savings before you have to pay for repair parts. There are A TON of moving and expensive parts in a tankless heater. Also there is maintenance that should be done annually like descaling the heat exchanger. 2) the heater SHOULD give you whatever temp you ask of it but at a cost of flow. Internal valves reduce the flow through the heater in an attempt to reach the desired setting. 3) the savings calculations the manufacturers publish are given in an optimum environment with warmer incoming water temps and minimal usage. I've been a licensed plumber for over 10 years and I won't put one in my own home. There are better choices out there and better ways to improve efficiency within your home. All that being said, a lot of people enjoy them and in some cases like the OP where there are only a couple people in the home and minimal usage they are better than say a 50gal electric WH. But that depends on the cost of natural gas/propane at the time.