Great article about 3rd party voting.

[dwalker460]

Blame? Thats a liberal issue my man. I wont "blame" anyone. I will tell you that at this point in history, a 3rd party is not going to win a Presidency.
Now, if a 3rd party was to become organized, win elections at the local and state level, have a fair number of actual members of the party elected to Congress (lets say 10-15%), have actual members of the party considered for SCOTUS positions, etc. THEN MAYBE a 3rd party would work. A 3rd party President at this point will be a lame duck and get jack shit done. He will not be respected by either Dems or GOP and the public at large will see him as a charlatan. A vote for a 3rd party President is not a vote for change, its a vote because your being a pissy little brat.

Personally, the 3D party sounds exactly like a Conservative who cannot deal with the reality of modern life, and who wants to go back to the pioneer days. I have yet to talk to a third party supporter who had a real clue about taxes other than "flat tax" or other sweeping generalizations, and who really can only spout off a bunch of generalizations about reducing goverment (hey sounds like a Republican platform!) with no actual method to do it besides radio show commentary of "get rid of all government agencies- why do we need a Department of Agriculture or bla blah blah"- yeah, theres a solution in there somewhere.

Third party supporters keep trying to maintain that both the existing parties are the same, and they are wrong and absolutely close minded when it is suggested they actually look into the policies and history they are basing their opinions on.

Full Disclosure- one of my good friends is a Libertarian, and we argue back and forth a lot. I cant change his belief, and he cannot find enough facts to get me to support his.

[HoneyBadger]

Blame? Thats a liberal issue my man. I wont "blame" anyone.

I'll hold you to that after the election.

A 3rd party President at this point will be a lame duck and get jack shit done.

How is this a bad thing?

A vote for a 3rd party President is not a vote for change, its a vote because your being a pissy little brat.

Take it easy you presumptuous dick.

Personally, the 3D party sounds exactly like a Conservative who cannot deal with the reality of modern life, and who wants to go back to the pioneer days.

The only thing right about what you just said is that Libertarians (a third party) want to go back to the freedoms that Americans had during the "pioneer days". I would contend that most Republicans who vote the ticket no matter what are the ones who cannot deal with reality of modern life.

I have yet to talk to a third party supporter who had a real clue about taxes other than "flat tax" or other sweeping generalizations, and who really can only spout off a bunch of generalizations about reducing goverment (hey sounds like a Republican platform!) with no actual method to do it besides radio show commentary of "get rid of all government agencies- why do we need a Department of Agriculture or bla blah blah"- yeah, theres a solution in there somewhere.

Clearly you have never listened to the Libertarian platform or any Libertarian candidate speak. "Flat tax" is not even a part of the Libertarian platform. Ron Paul and Gary Johnson both laid out very clear and specific plans for reducing government - In fact, Ron Paul was the only Republican Primary candidate with an actual plan to get America out of debt. It was all on paper with actual numbers and actual specific places where spending would be cut.

Third party supporters keep trying to maintain that both the existing parties are the same, and they are wrong and absolutely close minded when it is suggested they actually look into the policies and history they are basing their opinions on.

If you're gonna talk shit, back it up. Examples por favor.

Full Disclosure- one of my good friends is a Libertarian, and we argue back and forth a lot. I cant change his belief, and he cannot find enough facts to get me to support his.

Thanks for the "full disclosure"... Maybe your friend ought to do his research while you go do yours.

[dwalker460]

Then explain how RP can get ANYTHING through a Congress that will not work with him? Explain how he will enact the policies he has outlined. Explain how, within the Constitution, a 3rd Party candidate is going to be effective.

Dont worry, I will wait..



On the other hand, Obaloney can get things done because he has support in Congress and the SCOTUS. JUST LOOK AT OBAMACARE. Take off the blinders and actually see whats going on and how things work, because right now you sound like a radio talk show host- spouting off without having to account for or explain the HOW things actually will happen or work.

[roberth]

Then explain how RP can get ANYTHING through a Congress that will not work with him? Explain how he will enact the policies he has outlined. Explain how, within the Constitution, a 3rd Party candidate is going to be effective.

Dont worry, I will wait..



On the other hand, Obaloney can get things done because he has support in Congress and the SCOTUS. JUST LOOK AT OBAMACARE. Take off the blinders and actually see whats going on and how things work, because right now you sound like a radio talk show host- spouting off without having to account for or explain the HOW things actually will happen or work.

Agreed.

In order for things to happen groups of people need to come to an agreement. A 3rd party president will not be able to build this consensus simply because he does not know how.

The changes that have occured under the Obama administration have come about becuause many citizens, the media, congress, and cabinent members all agreed to them. A third party won't garner this kind of support.

We can go into inclusive (D) and (R) vs exclusive (3rd) but I've already covered that topic in a different post.

[Jer]

Then explain how RP can get ANYTHING through a Congress that will not work with him? Explain how he will enact the policies he has outlined. Explain how, within the Constitution, a 3rd Party candidate is going to be effective.

Dont worry, I will wait..

No need to wait long...

Let's start with the one true power a president has... Presidential Veto. You say he can't get anything done but what he CAN do is veto stuff that keeps taking our constitutional rights away that the current dip shits keep signing into law. NDAA, SOPA, The Patriot Act... I can go on but honestly vetoing any one of those by itself would have been worth having RP in office.

On the other hand, Obaloney can get things done because he has support in Congress and the SCOTUS. JUST LOOK AT OBAMACARE. Take off the blinders and actually see whats going on and how things work, because right now you sound like a radio talk show host- spouting off without having to account for or explain the HOW things actually will happen or work.

Yeah, he'll have lots of support from a Republican majority congress.

You don't think that having the first ever president that wasn't R or D would enact change at every level? You don't think the D's and R's would be forced to look at how bad they have gotten to lose the majority of the nation? And I'm the one blind to reality.

[Sharpienads]

Not that it really adds anything to the conversation, but I believe we have had a third party president before.

[TS12000]

This thread and all the other 3rd party threads are the shining example of why the right/republican/conservative whatever you want to call it will never learn. Cannibalism. Look at what you think of each other and will say about people who you should be embracing, good god. You (republicans and libertarians here) should be embracing each other. Remember Reagans conservative stool?

For my fellow Libertarians, please heed my request, stop being so hard headed. Going all or nothing from the current leaning of the party all the way to our views is impossible and snaps the ties to our conservative brethren and makes us look like children. Baby steps. Work to get those types you like in local elections, and actually getting national candidates that more resemble your views step by step. Is it all fluffy rainbows? no but polarizing yourself isn't the answer.

[Sharpienads]

This thread and all the other 3rd party threads are the shining example of why the right/republican/conservative whatever you want to call it will never learn. Cannibalism. Look at what you think of each other and will say about people who you should be embracing, good god. You (republicans and libertarians here) should be embracing each other. Remember Reagans conservative stool?

For my fellow Libertarians, please heed my request, stop being so hard headed. Going all or nothing from the current leaning of the party all the way to our views is impossible and snaps the ties to our conservative brethren and makes us look like children. Baby steps. Work to get those types you like in local elections, and actually getting national candidates that more resemble your views step by step. Is it all fluffy rainbows? no but polarizing yourself isn't the answer.

One of the most logical things I've read today.

[Jer]

This thread and all the other 3rd party threads are the shining example of why the right/republican/conservative whatever you want to call it will never learn. Cannibalism. Look at what you think of each other and will say about people who you should be embracing, good god. You (republicans and libertarians here) should be embracing each other. Remember Reagans conservative stool?

For my fellow Libertarians, please heed my request, stop being so hard headed. Going all or nothing from the current leaning of the party all the way to our views is impossible and snaps the ties to our conservative brethren and makes us look like children. Baby steps. Work to get those types you like in local elections, and actually getting national candidates that more resemble your views step by step. Is it all fluffy rainbows? no but polarizing yourself isn't the answer.

In a perfect world this is all great ideas. In the real world it's just not working. In a perfect world RP would be on the ballot as he rightfully deserves. In a perfect world Republicans wouldn't see all 3rd party candidates as loons and crazies since that's what the media told them to think and would take the time to get to actually know them and become amazed by how much they actually agree with. In a perfect world people would actually research what their candidate has DONE IN THE PAST instead of what the media says about them or what they say themselves. In a perfect world people would vote for the candidate they believed was the right man for the job and shit can this 'lesser of two evils' bullshit. In a perfect world people wouldn't make up shit on the internet or wherever anyone will listen about 3rd party candidates to make others think they're crazy since most people don't think for themselves but that doesn't mean their vote counts any less.

That's not the world we live in unfortunately and all the people with better ideas just sit idly by on the sidelines hoping someone will notice them while they watch the train careen out of control.

[Teufelhund]

This thread and all the other 3rd party threads are the shining example of why the right/republican/conservative whatever you want to call it will never learn. Cannibalism. Look at what you think of each other and will say about people who you should be embracing, good god. You (republicans and libertarians here) should be embracing each other. Remember Reagans conservative stool?

For my fellow Libertarians, please heed my request, stop being so hard headed. Going all or nothing from the current leaning of the party all the way to our views is impossible and snaps the ties to our conservative brethren and makes us look like children. Baby steps. Work to get those types you like in local elections, and actually getting national candidates that more resemble your views step by step. Is it all fluffy rainbows? no but polarizing yourself isn't the answer.

Well said. The most retarded part is most of the self-proclaimed conservatives are libertarian and just don't realize it. Take a look at the definitions some folks are throwing out in one of the other recent threads. They seem to know what they want, but are too scared or stubborn to realize they're voting for something else. I'm tired of arguing with them about it. I need to remember I can lead a person to a solution, but I can't make him think.