Libya, Mogadishu, WTF

[BPTactical]

Along your line Travis - I have heard speculation that this was concocted plan that was to be an "October Surprise" to boost BO and make him a "military genius" and "hero" for saving a kidnapped Ambassador.
They knew damn well in advance that 9-11 would bring the muzzie rats out would be stirring shit up.
Let Stevens get kidnapped, send in ST 6 or similar and rescue him.
Barry saves the day.
It ran afoul.

I have also heard speculation that Stevens was an "inconvenience" in an arms trading scheme.
Possibly the WH saw this as an opportunity to remove an "inconvenience" by the hands of jihads.
Vince Foster and Iran Contra rolled into one.

Who knows?

[trlcavscout]

Definitley stinks! The ambassador was already "missing", the remaining men were shooting it out, and they get denied help? The WH obviously got what they wanted out of this what ever it was. Pretty damn sickening!!!

[Madusa]

The way I've heard it we have aircraft in Italy and they can make it there in less than an hour. Also we have two Destroyers off the coast, they have missiles (cruise). There was a drone and real time communications with our guys (SEALs- know how to call in an air strike). We could have leveled the city in less than an hour. It pisses me off all to hell to think that the USA let our guys die without causing serious damage. In Mogadishu we should have destroyed that city saving our guys.

[trlcavscout]

The way I've heard it we have aircraft in Italy and they can make it there in less than an hour. Also we have two Destroyers off the coast, they have missiles (cruise). There was a drone and real time communications with our guys (SEALs- know how to call in an air strike). We could have leveled the city in less than an hour. It pisses me off all to hell to think that the USA let our guys die without causing serious damage. In Mogadishu we should have destroyed that city saving our guys.

Those are two way different situations. We provoked them in Somalia by operating in their back yard without proper authority, we wouldnt want china or someone pulling that crap here, the whole operation was a mess from the start and should have been handled differently. But yes after it hit the fan we should have leveled that shit hole and been done. Now we import them here for cheap labor and have to deal with their dumb ass's.

The embassy should have been evacuated earlier in the fight. It was technically an unsolicited attack because the ambassador had a right to work their, although I dont agree with it. But to rescue Americans in that situation should have been top priority and no punches should have been pulled. Yes we had the feet on the ground and the planes in the sky to do what ever was necesary, but we had a pansy at the wheel. But again we should have been out of there weeks earlier and their would have been no need to fight.

They did show that they head designators on the source of the morter rounds, at the very least we could have remotely leveled the playing field for god sakes!

[Mick-Boy]

Seriously? Leveling cities? Just kill 'em all and let god sort 'em out huh?

Do you know how hard it is to get permission to drop ordinance on a mountain side in Afghanistan? You really think anyone is going to clear dropping in a city populated by people we supported during a civil war?

The unfortunate reality is that operations in war-torn locations have the potential to go really bad, really fast.

That the POTUS fucked this up by the numbers is pretty common knowledge at this point. Suggesting that it was somehow orchestrated by the US Govt is really, really deep into tin-foil land.

[BPTactical]

New developments: Panetta is claiming that they did not have enough information "in time" to send in assets.
Bullshit, we know they watched it unfold in very near "real time".
Now there appears to be evidence that the CIA ordered the operators to stand down when shots were heard coming from the consulate.
3 urgent requests for military assistance denied.
Repeatedly requested a Specter gunship, request either ignored or denied.


You still don't think the Administration/.gov is not neckdeep in this?

[Fmedges]

Broken Arrow was a term used in Vietnam.

Broken Arrow - Radio code for a unit about to be overrun; diverts all Tactical air to support that unit.

Basically all available air assets divert from their current mission to provide CAS. Unless you had someone on the ground that could act as a FAC, air would be totally useless. They would not just show up and start drop ordnance if they did not know the position of friendlies. Keep in mind that Air doesn't work like it does in the movies. If the enemy is 600 meters or closer it is extremely rare that air will be cleared in.

[Mick-Boy]

New developments: Panetta is claiming that they did not have enough information "in time" to send in assets.
Bullshit, we know they watched it unfold in very near "real time".
Now there appears to be evidence that the CIA ordered the operators to stand down when shots were heard coming from the consulate.
3 urgent requests for military assistance denied.
Repeatedly requested a Specter gunship, request either ignored or denied.


You still don't think the Administration/.gov is not neckdeep in this?

I'm going to assume that last was directed at me.

Fucked up the response? Yep. Orchestrated? Highly doubtful.

In 2007 I participated in closing the US Regional Embassy Office at the Palace in Basra Iraq and moving it to the Basra Airfield. From April to July 2007 the REO closed it was the single most attacked US installation in world. We took over 600 rockets and mortars in July alone. Want to know who got sent in to help us out?

No one. Why? The Brits were drawing down after Brown was elected PM and the US was busy with the Sunnis in the north and we didn't want to kick off fighting in more provinces by attacking a bunch of Shia in the south.

This past July 4th I got called out with a small team to search an installation in Afghanistan that had blown up (cause unknown at the time, later determined to be an accident) for a missing American. After being on site for several hours we received word that everyone was accounted for. We had been sent out because someone forgot that there was a guy on leave.

My point is that there are a lot of factors on the table when the head shed is looking at committing assets and the "fog of war" is a real thing.

Looking at something days or weeks or months later, it's easy to see what would have been needed. In the heat of the moment, not so much.

Could they have diverted more assets to Libya? Yes. Would they have gotten there in time? Maybe. Would they have made the situation better or worse? We'll never know. Just like we'll never really know who knew what, when.

Was the response fucked? Yep. Did Obama plot the attack of an American Diplomatic Mission for political ends? I'll believe that around the same time I buy the theory that Bush blew up the Twin Towers to expand government control.

[Mick-Boy]

http://www.therightscoop.com/must-wa...d-no-response/

Here's a guy providing a little insight into the process for pushing SOF troops into this kind of situation.

I'll say it again. The response was fucked up by the numbers but I don't buy for a second that it was plotted by our Government.

[BPTactical]

I pull absolutely nothing off the table when it comes to this Administration furthering their agenda/re election.

The bastards are evil.

Q-Why would they try to cover their keesters with a lame ass story about a video clip being the cause of violence on 9/11 when the video had been out for months? If they needed to cover incompetence then simply saying "We did not have enough intel to act" would be plausible.

A-As a reason to stomp the 1st Amendment by passing an anti defamation law. 1st step to censorship on a wholesale level.

Q-What was the purpose of "Fast and Furious"?

A-As a reason to further trample the 2cnd Amendment.

Q-Why has this administration refused to acknowledge radical Islam for what it is? Look at the Ft Hood shooting. They have yet to call it an act of terror, rather "workplace violence" when numerous witnesses state Hassan was yelling "Allah Ahkbar" as he was firing.
A-????
We need to realize we are not dealing with a "normal" administration.
This man comes from known radical and communist roots. Look into his chief advisor, Valerie Jarrett. What you will find on her should be quite disconcerting in and of itself. Now add to that the other key staff members that he has surrounded himself with.