So 64 just got signed

[clublights]

5 nanograms is the limit that Representative King wants to put in place as a minimum level of THC intoxication to be charged with DUI/D. It is the intoxication level that other states have enacted. However, the pro pot community does not want this level as they argue you can have this amount in your system and not be what they consider to be under the influence.

yes I meant nanograms LOL

the way I've heard it reported I thought it was already the standard... my bad

Yeah I understand that pro pot community didn't like the 5 nanograms as it can just be residual. and picking a "standard" is tough.... I personally believe that .08 is not exactly fair for all folks and all body types but it is what the law is .
We need to come up with a standard that is fair to the people and LE

I also understand that we need to come up with a roadside instant test ...

[Ronin13]

5 nanograms is the limit that Representative King wants to put in place as a minimum level of THC intoxication to be charged with DUI/D. It is the intoxication level that other states have enacted. However, the pro pot community does not want this level as they argue you can have this amount in your system and not be what they consider to be under the influence.

Again, this is why it's too slippery-slope... THC stays in the system much longer than the effects, plus it's not like alcohol where you can have a beer, wait and then drive safely an hour later. You smoke, there is no slightly high, moderately high, really high... you're high or you're not high.

[bigmyk2k]

I have always been on the side of legalize. People are going to sell it, people are going to use it.

I have heard this argument from those arguing to legalize for years, and it has never held water. Not saying legalization is the wrong thing, just that it is a terrible argument.

Let's try a few word substitutions:
Why is murder illegal? People kill people all the time anyway! Just make it legal, and you won't have all those people going to prison.
Why is drunk-driving illegal? People drive drunk all the time anyway! Just make it legal, and you won't have all those people going to prison.
Why is stealing illegal? People steal stuff all the time anyway! Just make it legal, and you won't have all those hungry people going to prison.
Why is coke/heroine/crack illegal? People snort/shoot-up all the time anyway! Just make it legal, and you won't have all those people going to prison. (these get closer to the line, as it is harder to define any victim other than the user, but believe me, they're out there)
Rape
Child Molestation
Kidnapping

Don't get me wrong, I all for freedom and deregulation. However, there are some things that are inherently morally reprehensible, and should not be tolerated in any amount.

[Zundfolge]

There are two kinds of limits on our liberties under the law.

Malum In Se and Malum Prohibitum

Actions and things that are Malum In Se are illegal because they are inherently wrong, evil or infringe on the rights of your fellow citizens (in other words "wrong in and of themselves).

Actions and things that are Malum Prohibitum are illegal simply because they have been made illegal (in other words wrong because somebody said so).

It would seem to me that a system of laws grounded in individual liberty and constituted under the precept that we are ruled by laws and not by men would be primarily (almost exclusively) on Malum In Se with little to no Malum Prohibitum laws allowed.


So I'd say that anyone that smokes pot is an idjut, but there is nothing inherently evil about it (providing it to children and driving under the influence notwithstanding).

[bigmyk2k]

providing it to children and driving under the influence notwithstanding.

I fully, and heartily, agree.

[Fmedges]

Who is to judge what is evil or inherently wrong?

[Ronin13]

I have heard this argument from those arguing to legalize for years, and it has never held water. Not saying legalization is the wrong thing, just that it is a terrible argument.

You know the other argument I've heard that is just flat out wrong? "It's harmless." Or "It's not as bad as alcohol." This is just flat out lies, and it's another terrible argument.
Scientific studies (although dampened by federal law) have concluded that smoked marijuana contains 3x the tar found in tobacco, 50% more carcinogens... so the common argument that smoking cigarettes is worse is also false.
Here are some neat facts I was able to dig up from multiple peer-reviewed sources:

The short-term effects of marijuana include:

• Distorted Perception(sights, sounds, time, touch)
• Problems with memory and learning
• Loss of coordination
• Trouble with thinking and problem-sovling
• Increased heart rate, reduced blood pressure

Sometimes marijuana use can also produce anxiety, fear, distrust, or panic.
Effects on the Brain

The active ingredient in marijuana, delta-9 tetrahydrocannabinol or THC, acts on cannabinoid receptors on nerve cells and influences the activity of those cells. Some brain areas have many cannabinoid receptors, but other areas of the brain have few or none at all. Many cannabinoid receptors are found in the parts of the brain that influence pleasure, memory, thought, concentration, sensory and time perception, and coordinated movement.When high doses of marijuana are used, usually when eaten in food rather than smoked, users can experience the following symptoms:

• Hallucinations
• Delusions
• Impaired memory
• Disorientation

Effects on the Heart

Within a few minutes after smoking marijuana, the heart begins beating more rapidly and the blood pressure drops. Marijuana can cause the heart beat to increase by 20 to 50 beats per minute, and can increase even more if other drugs are used at the same time.Because of the lower blood pressure and higher heart rate, researchers found that users' risk for a heart attack is four times higher within the first hour after smoking marijuana, compared to their general risk of heart attack when not smoking.
Other Health Effects

Research indicates that THC impairs the body's immune system from fighting disease, which can cause a wide variety of health problems. One study found that marijuana actually inhibited the disease-preventing actions of key immune cells. Another study found that THC increased the risk of developing bacterial infections and tumors.Effects of Exposure During Pregnancy

Several studies have found that children born to mothers who used marijuana during pregnancy exhibit some problems with neurological development. According to those studies, prenatal marijuana exposure can cause:

• Altered responses to visual stimuli
• Increased tremulousness
• Problems with sustained attention and memory
• Poor problem-sovling skills

[Fmedges]

While I'm thinking about it, since this is such a cash cow and a revenue generator, where exactly can one buy pot currently that is taxed? (People without a medical card)

[Zundfolge]

Who is to judge what is evil or inherently wrong?

Back when we were a people rooted in common sense and not mired in political correctness and critical theory nobody needed a third party to judge what was evil or inherently wrong.

But if you want a simple, non-religion based answer just use the Non-Aggression Principle. Or even simpler The Golden Rule.

Either would be better than the arbitrary rule of men writing Malum Prohibitum laws willy nilly.

[jerrymrc]

Memories...