I agree that you make valid counter-arguments for some anti-gunners, but it appears to be more defensive than offensive. I personally find whipping out the 2nd is productive; as most libtards believe heavily in the remaining Bill of Rights, especially the 1st Amendment. I find myself successfully asking the question "why do your rights as an American over-ride mine?". That can lead, and does, into a plethora of other questions and/or arguments which I'm sure most on this forum can counter. It will end at the same point: those that wish to do evil, will do evil, regardless of the tools he or she uses.