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  1. #1
    Machine Gunner
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    Default A reasonable compromise?

    A REASONABLE COMPROMISE?


    As it seems that the current administration is determined to place rather extreme restrictions on firearm ownership in the immediate future, I recently posted about the Draconian and Byzantine nature of the New York gun control laws which apparently are being utilized as the template for new legislation. It seems rather asinine to attempt to force NYC gun laws on the residents of rural Kentucky, Arizona, and Alaska, yet that is what has been proposed . . . and there is a very real possibility President Obama may approve that proposal and even bypass Congressional oversight to sign it into law via Executive Order without fully considering the fact that any citizen who failed to comply in full with such a decree could have their Rights of citizenship stripped from them and face the threat of imprisonment. Never before in the history of our nation has the power of Executive Order been abused in such a punitive and ill-considered manner, and I truly hope that does not occur in this instance.

    The gun control proponents stated that they were willing to take under consideration opposing viewpoints, but from what I have heard that does not seem to be the case at all. They seem convinced that they are 100% correct in their position that guns are the problem, and other issues leading to social violence can be addressed only after so called “assault weapons” and high capacity magazines are outlawed and confiscated. It appears as if they have already fully committed to this decision, as mass civilian disarmament has been a top priority of their agenda for well over 20 years.

    If the gun control proponents actually were serious about considering opposing viewpoints, and actually wished to stop social violence with minimal impact on our Freedoms, I would propose implementation of the following policies:

    1. EDUCATION: I propose that Ethics become a mandatory aspect of the public school curriculum, starting with basic concepts in elementary school and being a 2 year course in high school. This coursework should be nondenominational and nonpolitical, focusing primarily on courtesy, conflict resolution, and respecting the rights and property of others. It should be a practical and useful course of study where differences of opinion would be recognized and explored, rather than some namby-pamby politically correct attempt to homogenize students into inoffensive lockstepping automatons. While it is important to understand and appreciate that some individuals may be inordinately sensitive about their “feelings” and “self esteem,” that is not the focus of an Ethics lesson. The core concepts should be values such as, “Don’t beat, rob, rape, defraud, steal, or lie.” Learning about anti-social, predatory, and sociopathic personality types should be a part of coursework at the high school level. Basic concepts should include: “Don’t bully,” “don’t date rape,” “keep your word,” and “apologize if you accidentally offend or injure someone.” Unfortunately, these simple concepts are rarely addressed in any meaningful way in the public schools.

    2. PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENTS: I propose that a campaign be undertaken to promote firearm safety and non violence. Public service announcements on television and the internet can address: what to do if you discover an unsecured firearm, de-escalation of conflict, and the dangers of aggressive driving. These should be limited to simple, easily remembered, common sense bits of advice which can be viewed and absorbed in under 180 seconds to accommodate limited attention spans. Public service announcements should be non-denominational, non-political, and appeal primarily to teenaged viewers and young adults.

    3. AGGRESSIVELY PROSECUTE VIOLENT CRIME: Some major cities have severe problems with recidivist predatory criminals. Because the jails are filled beyond capacity and the courts are overwhelmed, many receive undeserved leniency and early release, leaving them free to reoffend and victimize innocent citizens. The reason our jails are overcrowded is because they are filled with non-violent petty criminals, usually there due to theft or drugs. I propose attempting treatment and reintegration with the sad sacks and focusing on locking up the hard cases who present a clear danger to society. No rapist or armed robber should ever be allowed to plea bargain to a misdemeanor and be released on probation simply because the jails were too full . . . and the answer is clearly not “build more jails” because we incarcerate a higher percentage of our population than any other nation, often for long stretches far out of proportion to the offense due to mandatory minimum sentencing guidelines and strict “zero tolerance” policies, which seem to be causing many more problems than they solve. Every case needs to be judged on its own merit, and unduly harsh sentences for petty offenses are a drain on resources and a waste of tax dollars. Anyone who uses a weapon to victimize innocent civilians needs to be removed from society for the duration, as every study clearly shows that very few are capable of rehabilitation and most will reoffend shortly after release.

    4. RETHINK MENTAL HEALTH POLICY: Obviously, closing all the mental institutions and overprescribing anti-depressants to healthy school children was not the answer. It is true that mental institutions have a rather despicable history with many severe abuses which can never be permitted to occur again: lobotomies, electroconvulsive therapy, ice baths, physical and sexual abuse by staff, and involuntary commitment of political dissidents or disagreeable relatives. We are painfully aware of these past abuses. The new facilities will be much safer and there will be oversight and transparency. We need a place to warehouse the millions of schizophrenics and psychotics currently wandering the streets and overflowing homeless shelters, as in many cases they clearly present a danger to themselves and others, and the shelters and jails are not equipped to deal with their specific needs. In the case of most mass shooters, it was glaringly obvious to nearly everyone who came into contact with them that something was seriously wrong, and many teachers or co-workers later stated that they had been afraid the shooter was capable of such an act and had even spoken to supervisors about the potential threat, but nothing was done. In the future, if there is a valid and credible concern that an individual might present an immediate threat to others, there needs to be a fast track to evaluation and possibly therapy or even in-patient treatment, if deemed warranted. Of course, there will need to be significant and appreciable oversight regarding involuntary commitment, as it is certain to be misapplied at times.

    5. NATIONWIDE LICENSING: Due to the extreme variance in laws between states, where what is perfectly legal in one jurisdiction becomes a felony with zero tolerance and mandatory minimums the instant one crosses a border, it is clearly necessary to implement a fair and reasonable licensing program at the federal level. A national license implementing a background check prior to issuance would both protect society from violent criminals seeking to purchase guns and protect the rights of all citizens, but it must not be mandated simply to possess a firearm in one’s home. A firearm license could be required to purchase any firearm from a FFL dealer, which includes all retail stores, gun shows, and internet sales. This license would also serve as a concealed carry permit valid in all 50 states, excepting federal property and public schools. As a fair and reasonable compromise, the license may also be required to lawfully possess semi-automatic firearms fitted with high capacity magazines in densely populated metropolitan areas, and failure to comply could result in forfeiture and fine. However, semi-automatic firearms securely locked in a gun safe or similar contrivance would never be subject to forfeiture, absent any other complaint. NFA firearms would require additional licensing, and current laws regarding them could remain intact, although the new license would be valid in all 50 states. Background checks could still be implemented at the seller’s discretion. Purchasing firearms to be resold to individuals lacking a license would be prosecuted if there was reasonable suspicion they were intended to be used in a crime or facilitate a criminal enterprise, and additional felony charges could apply if the firearm in question was recovered from a crime scene within a year of the date of purchase. A license would be revoked upon arrest for any crime or involuntary commitment to either a mental hospital or an addiction treatment center. Concealed carry without a valid permit could be prosecuted as a misdemeanor offense with a fine and forfeiture of the weapon in question, unless the jurisdiction in question permits concealed carry without a permit. Major metropolitan areas may choose to restrict open carry if they wish, but in rural areas it must be permitted. Concealed carry by a violent felony offender, or a person under the influence of drugs or publically intoxicated, would be prosecuted as a felony. Simple possession of a handgun in one’s vehicle, or a semi-automatic rifle in one’s home, should be permitted as guaranteed by the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution, unless the possessor is under court supervision due to criminal or mental health proceedings and specifically barred from possessing firearms. Any misuse of a firearm, including brandishing and reckless endangerment, would be prosecuted aggressively as a serious felony offense.

    I believe this simple 5-step plan for: education, public service announcements, aggressively prosecuting violent crime, rethinking mental health policy, and nationwide licensing is a reasonable compromise and a far more optimistic and positive change than criminalizing a significant percentage of responsible and law-abiding gun owners, thereby infringing the Constitutionally guaranteed Rights of all citizens..


    Permission granted to repost provided the original text remains unaltered.


    edited to add the following clarification:

    I feel that a 50 state license would be a reasonable compromise. A license would not be mandatory to own, sell, transfer, or possess a firearm. There would be NO REGISTRATION nor would there be an expiry date. Any database would simply verify whether a license was valid or suspended or revoked. The license would be evidence that the holder had already passed a background check and could then be entitled to instantly purchase any firearm at a retail outlet or gun show, and would be permitted to conceal carry in all 50 states.
    Last edited by Clint45; 01-12-2013 at 15:31. Reason: addendum

  2. #2
    Fleeing Idaho to get IKEA Bailey Guns's Avatar
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    Default

    Scanned it, saw "Licensing", by the Feds, and figured I'd read far enough.

    No.
    Stella - my best girl ever.
    11/04/1994 - 12/23/2010



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  3. #3
    Caught Behind Enemy Lines
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailey Guns View Post
    Scanned it, saw "Licensing", by the Feds, and figured I'd read far enough.

    No.
    how would you feel about a buyers card like nebraska . basically you fill out the 4473 once with the sheriff and they mail a card . once you have a card you present it to anyone who wishes to sell a firearm to insure that the seller is covered . granted this system does not stop criminals from breaking the law but it does eliminate the need to run a 4473 every time you want to purchase at a store.

  4. #4
    Varmiteer hammer03's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alxone View Post
    how would you feel about a buyers card like nebraska . basically you fill out the 4473 once with the sheriff and they mail a card . once you have a card you present it to anyone who wishes to sell a firearm to insure that the seller is covered . granted this system does not stop criminals from breaking the law but it does eliminate the need to run a 4473 every time you want to purchase at a store.
    This. I just sent an idea similar to this to Rep Stephens. And remove make/model/SN from a 4473, and bingo! Gun grabbers get their background checks, and nobody gets their 2A (more) stepped on. This card should be available at every sporting goods store, SO/PD HQ, Walmart, etc, just like a fishing or hunting license. And it should be limited to 24 hour turn around. If they can't do an "instant" background check under 24 hours, the liability is on them (current CCW also counts, to avoid having to reprocess all those folks).

  5. #5
    Death Eater Troublco's Avatar
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    I liked it right up to #5. Drop #5 and I think it's fine. Otherwise, I agree with those who say there is NO more compromise when it comes to our rights. There's already been too much, and the only people who have gotten anything out of it is them. (Yeah, I know, the amorphous "them"...)
    SI VIS PACEM, PARA BELLUM

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  6. #6
    Bang Bang Ridge's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by alxone View Post
    how would you feel about a buyers card like nebraska . basically you fill out the 4473 once with the sheriff and they mail a card . once you have a card you present it to anyone who wishes to sell a firearm to insure that the seller is covered . granted this system does not stop criminals from breaking the law but it does eliminate the need to run a 4473 every time you want to purchase at a store.
    Seems like the people on this forum would rather lose everything than submit to a minor inconvenience.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridge View Post
    Seems like the people on this forum would rather lose everything than submit to a minor inconvenience.
    I'm not going to lose shit.... and I'm not going to submit to anything.

    Think about that.

  8. #8
    Bang Bang Ridge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NMB2 View Post
    I'm not going to lose shit.... and I'm not going to submit to anything.

    Think about that.
    You'll have plenty of time to think about it yourself in jail. Unless you're dead.

  9. #9
    Fleeing Idaho to get IKEA Bailey Guns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ridge View Post
    Seems like the people on this forum would rather lose everything than submit to a minor inconvenience.
    I'm already subjected to many minor inconveniences:
    • Fill out a federal form to buy a gun
    • Submit to a background check
    • Wait, possibly several days, for the "InstaCheck" to be completed
    • Which might entail an additional trip to the gun store
    • I'm told by the government where I can take my gun
    • I'm restricted by the government as to how I can carry my gun
    • I'm charged a fee by the government if I want to carry my gun in a certain way
    • I can't have certain guns because the government doesn't trust me
    • I have to pay an astronomically, artificially inflated price to own certain guns or accessories
    • I have to pay taxes non gun owners don't have to pay
    • I'm vilified by the media because I like guns
    • etc, etc, etc...


    So you can take your additional "minor inconveniences"...somewhere else.

    Besides...it's not like we're going to have any say on whether or not any particular anti-gun law is passed. Well, I guess we'll have a say...it's just nobody's listening or cares.
    Stella - my best girl ever.
    11/04/1994 - 12/23/2010



    Don't wanna get shot by the police?
    "Stop Resisting Arrest!"


  10. #10
    Machine Gunner sroz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailey Guns View Post
    Besides...it's not like we're going to have any say on whether or not any particular anti-gun law is passed. Well, I guess we'll have a say...it's just nobody's listening or cares.
    You hit the nail on the head. We may all have some tough decisions coming up. We'll all individually just have to consider ALL consequences before deciding.

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