Background checks and serial numbers

[CrufflerSteve]

I believe the instant check info sent will tell type of weapon such as pistol, rifle shotgun or other (receiver). I could be wrong on that. No serial #.

The form you fill out will have the serial number, make & such along with your name and address. If the ATF does a trace they start at the top with the manufacturer or importer and work their way to the FFL. If private sales are banned there will be a paper trail all the way.

[kwando]

No you cannot. The item Must be On site and logged in prior to CBI Call in. You have an ATF SURPRISE audit while in the waiting process and Say Goodbye FFL.
So FFL X where exactly is this Firearm you are selling Mr. Kwando? Not in inventory, OOPS!
If that were the case i'd have 4 4473's in process now. How can you submit w/out info. Considering the approval might just be completed before said gun arrived?

Well the place i use must be breaking the law, because I've done it before.

[Ronin13]

Well the place i use must be breaking the law, because I've done it before.

I was just going to say- I've seen people doing this a lot lately- Internet order, FFL transfer, not arrived yet, but to hasten the process they are getting their checks done prior to the transfer's arrival.

[asmo]

The only time that info is shared is if the BATFE needs a trace on a particular gun or if the compliance inspector makes a note of it during an inspection of the FFL premises. The other way would be if the FFL goes out of business and sends his records in to the BATFE Out of Business center.

Where it is promptly scanned, indexed, and compared. Our tax dollars pay for someone to sit in front of a computer, looking at scanned pages from A&D books, trying to decipher someone's handwriting.

Upon recieving:
1. The date of receipt of the firearm;
2. The name and address of the non-licensee or the name and FFL license number of the licensee from whom you received the firearm;
3. The name of the manufacturer and importer (if any) of the firearm;
4. The model of the firearm;
5. The serial number of the firearm;
6. The type of firearm (pistol, revolver, rifle, shotgun, receiver, frame, etc); and
7. The caliber or gauge of the firearm.


Upon selling or otherwise disposing of:
1. The date of sale or other disposition of the firearm;
2. The name and address of the non-licensee or the name and FFL license number of the licensee to whom the firearm was transferred.


So if your going to use an FFL -- use someone big that is going to stay in business for a long while and don't buy multiple guns in a 5 day period (see info on MSR 3310.4 in post below). Note that only helps some as the ATF can request records at any time - and routinely do for investigations.

[hatidua]

When the Dougherty trio did their little cross country crime spree that started in FL and ended on I-25 in Colorado, authorities very conveniently knew exactly what guns they had with them before they were caught. Things that make you go hmmm.........

[asmo]

#1: I understand the gun's serial number is attached to the info sent to CBI, correct?

No. As Jim said neither the SN or Manf is sent to the ATF/FBI. When you do your 4473. Just "Long Gun", "Handgun", or "Other".

UNLESS you are multiple purchaser then the FFL has to do a 3310.4 (Multiple Sales Report). ALL 3310.4s are in the FTS - DIRECTLY LINKING YOU WITH THE GUNs. The 3310.4 requires the FFL to report Type, SN, Manf, Model, Importer, Caliber, and Transfer Date -- along with all your pertinent info.

Regardless of what they "unofficially" do, is there a publicly acknowledged database linking that serial to me, beyond the FFL's "bound book"?

The FTS is publicly acknowledged. The NTC has a nice building on the Martinsburg, WV ranch/campus

[Bailey Guns]

Where it is promptly scanned, indexed, and compared...

Promptly? I'm not so sure about that. I received a trace request from the BATFE 3 YEARS, and at least 2 trace requests 2 years, after I closed my business and sent in my records. I've was told the backlog of records to be entered was several years long.

During one of the trace requests I told the person calling that I'd sent my records in over 2 years earlier. She kinda laughed and said, "So much for this trace." It's not that I don't think the gov't would maintain a database or even wants to maintain a database. I'm just not so sure they can actually keep up with it.

I sort of envision a warehouse along the lines of the one in the Indiana Jones movie where they stored the Ark.

[asmo]

I sort of envision a warehouse along the lines of the one in the Indiana Jones movie where they stored the Ark.

Actually its long lines of stacked record boxes filling conference rooms and down halls -- with a converted garage serving as a holding area.

[OneGuy67]

When the Dougherty trio did their little cross country crime spree that started in FL and ended on I-25 in Colorado, authorities very conveniently knew exactly what guns they had with them before they were caught. Things that make you go hmmm.........

As one who was involved in that investigation, I can tell you we knew what kind of guns they had because the youngest told his probation officer about them after he pled guilty to his case in Florida, just prior to their spree. Not to mention the video from the bank, which also showed some of the firearms and recovered casings, the in-car video from the officer in Florida who was shot at and the casings recovered in that event.

[10mm-man]

No you cannot. The item Must be On site and logged in prior to CBI Call in. You have an ATF SURPRISE audit while in the waiting process and Say Goodbye FFL.
So FFL X where exactly is this Firearm you are selling Mr. Kwando? Not in inventory, OOPS!
If that were the case i'd have 4 4473's in process now. How can you submit w/out info. Considering the approval might just be completed before said gun arrived?

Glad you brought this up. Called the CBI and discussed putting in the info (BGC) without the client being here and signing the form. Figured it would save time if I could do this and keep the client from coming twice. He said I need to wait until the form was signed and info verified (ID or other) with the guy onsite. Went on about prosecution etc. Ok got that, will do when guy comes in, no prob.

However he never said I needed the gun onsite. I always have the gun onsite and then do BGC and have form 4473 signed and info verified, but here is the question; were does it say I need to have the gun onsite to run the BGC? I know I need it to complete the transfer, I am not doubting it is there, but would like the source.

Thanks Jim,