Couple of ??'s About 'Registration' of Firearms

[spqrzilla]

A lot of cops are full of nonsense when they talk to people. So I'm not surprised when I hear one give out false information. Sometimes its difficult to tell if they know that they are BS'ing or just ignorant.

[DHC]

There will be quite a few people, at the FTC and CJIS, happy to hear that they don't have to go to work anymore.

I apologize for missing the point of your response, but I am confused by it. Did I misinterpret the referenced article?

That article addressed the function of the ATF's National Tracing Center. Is there some connection to the FBI's Criminal Justice Information Services Division?

I can see that the anti-gun crowd would press to have all guns and their owners entered into a registry. It seems logical that an organization like the CJIS would be tasked with that duty. Running counter to that is the law cited by Teufelhund prohibiting the creation of such a registry by the Government.

Admittedly, I am just beginning to explore this and could easily be mistaken (and/or naive) in my interpretations. I welcome any 'illumination' from those more experienced and knowledgeable.

[Eggysrun]

If I recall correctly the colorado constitution directly prohibits registration.

If I recall recorrectly democrats don't give a shit about any constitution state or federal that doesn't aid their agendas lol

[asmo]

I covered this in another thread (http://www.ar-15.co/threads/82913-Ba...serial-numbers) about how your purchases can be put in FTS immediately (multiple purchases for example). That creates instant registration as it links you with the weapons. The Attorney General (for many years -- under authority of the GCA) has stated that multiple firearms purchases may be an indicator for criminal activity -- so its okay force those purchases into the FTS. This is what caused such an uproar about the reporting of long guns on MSRs in the southern border states - the Attorney General said no problem as those guns may be used in a crime (trafficing).

So, already, we have registration for weapons that have not been used in any criminal activity -- approved by the Attorney General. As has been shown, adding new classes of weapons to that list is fairly trivial since the justification (may be used in a crime) is already approved.

[OneGuy67]

While the Sheriff's are no longer putting the CCW information into CCIC like they used to due to the change in law, each Sheriff's office may keep an internal database that can be accessed by their Deputies. It may explain why people are constantly saying they are told by LEO's about their CCW. I know that when I query CCIC it isn't showing CCW's like it used to.

[OneGuy67]

I covered this in another thread (http://www.ar-15.co/threads/82913-Ba...serial-numbers) about how your purchases can be put in the FTC system immediately (multiple purchases for example). That creates instant registration as it links you with the weapons. The Attorney General (for many years) has stated that multiple firearms purchases may be an indicator for criminal activity -- so its okay force those purchases into the FTC.

So, already, we have registration for weapons that have not been used in any criminal activity.

While I don't know where you are getting your information, that hasn't been my experience with dealing with a firearm search. Most of my searches literally take several weeks to over a month to get back from the ATF and when I inquire why, I'm told it is all done by hand search of records. The only searches that come back quickly are recently purchased firearms, where it is a call to the manufacturer leading to a call to the dealer who sold it.

Again, I'm not disparaging your information, it just hasn't been my experience nor my conversations with ATF.

[Mountain Man]

The State of Colorado prohibits gun registration. CRS 29-11.7-102



29-11.7-102. Firearms database - prohibited



(1) A local government, including a law enforcement agency, shall not maintain a list or other form of record or database of:

(a) Persons who purchase or exchange firearms or who leave firearms for repair or sale on consignment;

(b) Persons who transfer firearms, unless the persons are federally licensed firearms dealers;

(c) The descriptions, including serial numbers, of firearms purchased, transferred, exchanged, or left for repair or sale on consignment.

[asmo]

While I don't know where you are getting your information, that hasn't been my experience with dealing with a firearm search. Most of my searches literally take several weeks to over a month to get back from the ATF and when I inquire why, I'm told it is all done by hand search of records. The only searches that come back quickly are recently purchased firearms, where it is a call to the manufacturer leading to a call to the dealer who sold it.

eTrace still causes a person to have to go do the search. I think there is a published number of NTC doing 350k traces a year - still takes awhile to get in queue. And its not like they have ALL the data ready to go (far far far from it).

The reasons why the recent traces are faster is because of automation of many FFLs and distributors (software based 4473s, bar codes for shipment tracking, etc.) -- at least that is what I am told.

[Great-Kazoo]

It's sad, and I would love for this guy to meet Jim so he can be set straight, but in my NRA Instructor cert class, we had a Commerce City cop say that when they pull someone over it shows them if the person has a CCW Permit (as recent as DEC). Then he said when they run your license/bgc they can see a list of all the firearms you own because of the 4473. I corrected his error and said that his information is false- the 4473 is submitted with only "Pistol", "Long Gun", or "Other" checked, no info goes to CBI regarding make, model, or serial... He rebutted and said that I was wrong- I finally just said, okay, you're the cop, I'm just the guy who has multiple friendships with FFLs (ya know, the people who actually DO that stuff).

We're talking Data base for gun registration not CCW info. Pay attention!
Regarding a Data base that was supposed to be no longer available for CCW, supposedly that was corrected. HOWEVER IF STILL IN EFFECT NOWHERE Does it come back with ANY FIREARM INFO AT ALL. When you apply for a CCW there is no place on the form that ask you to list what hand guns you will be carrying. NO WHERE.
The Sheriff's dept only knows you are applying for a CCW not the caliber / mfg of gun's. So for a CC or any other LE to tell you they KNOW What Firearms you OWN. Well once again they are full of shit.
Here is denvers
http://www.denvergov.org/Portals/720...pplication.pdf

Here is the Sheriff's Dept of CO standard CCW application.
http://jeffco.us/jeffco/sheriff_uploads/application.pdf

No where in either application is there a question regarding Firearms, Caliber, Serial #, mfg etc. Once again Ronin for the CC cop to tell you something incorrect you should have asked him to SHOW You his source, If not to retract his statement as it is a false one. I see you said he was incorrect. UNLESS we a gun owners correct these false hoods spewed by uninformed LE's the BS will continue.
One cop told me in order to own a 50 cal you needed to pay a yearly Lic Fee. i called him on it and to date he has not produced anything to back it up besides his own ignorance. Of course his co-worker just laughed and walked away.

Regarding Multiple purchases. That form is for HAND GUN MULTIPLE PURCHASES ONLY. NO LONG GUNS. PLEASE GET IT RIGHT. You can walk in buy 2 AR's 1 12ga and 1 hand gun. No forms are filled out besides the 4473. Now you buy 2 hand guns with in a 7 day period, then a Multiple purchase form is done and LE notified.

[Great-Kazoo]

I've had a LEO ask me if I had a firearm on my person because he had seen that I have a CHL in the system. I wouldn't be surprised if they had more than just that on me.

NOT once in 26 years of CCW permit has any LE ever asked me if i was carrying, never. That CCW info was done at the time by individual sheriff's, it was not a State requirement.