Differences and similarities of civilian competition and combat shooting

[Cylinder Head]

Someone a little butt hurt? Where you looking for an opportunity to tell us when you went through selection? I enjoyed the article. Saying "and that is why I only trust HK's" with no emperical data seems....well a little fanboyish.

http://pistol-training.com/archives/4027

Considering everyone needs to cite their sources whenever you enter a thread, here you go. 50,000 rounds, 1 stoppage. My "Cherry Creek SOCOM Squad" is at least well armed.

Todd from Pistol Training did the same with a P30. I have never had a stoppage with either of my HK's.

[RMAC757]

http://pistol-training.com/archives/4027

Considering everyone needs to cite their sources whenever you enter a thread, here you go. 50,000 rounds, 1 stoppage. My "Cherry Creek SOCOM Squad" is at least well armed.

Todd from Pistol Training did the same with a P30. I have never had a stoppage with either of my HK's.

Really....every time? Reference how many times I've done this.

[Cylinder Head]

Really....every time? Reference how many times I've done this.

You certainly seemed to want to bury yourself in my ass for making a comment about HK reliability. You really need empirical data or were you just making a douchebag comment for the sake of being a douchebag? Forgive me for assuming that on a gun forum, people knew that HK's are, if anything, reliable. If I said the trigger on my HK45 was like a Wilson Supergrade, then I can see you asking for data. Otherwise you're just trying to be an asshole.

[vectorsc]

I don't think anyone's gun floats my boat anymore as infallible. I've had 3 shit glocks out of the last 10, 1 bad hk p30l, so many 1911s that needed love...the steyr m guns...

A few of the gen 3 glocks were keepers though.


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[Kmanbay]

I am of the firm belief

"It's your ass on the Line.. it's your decision alone to make."

anyone can sit back and make the "your gun is poop" arguments all day long, but whether you decide a Baer, G-Lock, lorcin or a jennings is your gun of choice... its your choice alone.

Funny, this thread started out as a statment of the obvious between race guns and work, self defense guns.


It then turned into a 1911 versus the rest of the other guns.
Byte strike succintly summed it up right away.

Your gun=your ass. If it doesn't work when it is needed it doesn't matter how pretty, ugly, expensive or cheap it was because it just turned int oa family heirloom.

[jhood001]

I wonder if forums dedicated to the trades get once a month threads with people defending their Makita or DeWalt?

My guess is that most of them that actually work can't be bothered with it because their shift starts in 5 hours.

[O2HeN2]

This is why when I got my 1911 carry gun built (by Gary Kimball in the 'springs -- he reincarnated my single stack competition gun he had built about 2 decades before), it was built for reliability rather than accuracy. In typical Kimball fashion, I got both. Probably not a bullseye gun, but I don't have the abilities to be a bullseye shooter!

Upon receiving it I ran 500 rounds though it without cleaning or lubing (no "break in" period like many mass-produced guns). Full mags, partial mags and the last 100 rounds limp wristing it as much as possible without hitting myself in the forehead (weak handed, elbow bent, wrist bent, both relaxed, gun about 18" from my face).

Not only ran, but locked open after the last shot every time. Though things were slowing down and making that awful schtick-schtick sound of slow metal-on-metal slide operation - 1911 shooters will know what I'm talking about!

If you haven't done a similar test with YOUR carry gun you should.

Climbing on my soapbox: Limp wristing is not a shooter problem, it's a gun problem. If your gun, especially your carry gun, does not run while limp wristing it, get the gun fixed. You may not always have a perfect grip or shooting position in a defensive situation and your gun should be 100% reliable, limp wristed or not.

O2

[james_bond_007]

Thanks for posting the article.
I will look forward to more postings from you.

I'm not going to comment on the content, as I know you are not the author, and the author would not have a chance to address any of my comments anyway.

[Kraven251]

Many have said it, hell the article says it.

You can take a 1911, Glock, HK, Tokerav, or pretty much anything that is spec and absolutely the bees knees out of the box and fuck it up by wanting to improve it.

I've walked back into the gun culture after being removed from it for a number of years. The first thing I noticed is everyone has something to say about how to improve X firearm. The moment you have modified anything at all, that firearm is different than the designer intended. At that moment you have a custom gun, capable of custom failures.

Are the vast majority of these firearms reliable? Yes, or the active duty members of agencies all over the world wouldn't trust their lives to these devices everyday. However, the moment you have people monkeying with the trigger, the sear, a safety mechanism, stippling a grip...you have modified the structure and possibly the reliability of the weapon. I have also met very few people in the culture that have not wanted to show off their "awesome fucking gun," and talk about the modifications they have made to make it the greatest hot shit weapon on the planet. Seriously, we have almost all been guilty of that at some point, because we are proud of our hardware. Sometimes though we need to leave it the fuck alone.

I think while the author of the piece had some very good points, he also failed to address that simple fact, everyone that works with these weapon systems long enough wants to be a junior gunsmith or wants that extra edge. That mentality while admirable introduces failure points that most likely weren't there before.

I hate stock sights on a Glock; I get them replaced. I love the feel of 1911's. I love shooting them, but as so many of you have said, some are great some are shit. The primary difference is all about what have you done to the firearm, have you tested and re-tested under use conditions, put 500 rounds through it in a setting to see what happens. The failure isn't always at the weapon, often it starts with the operator fixing something that really didn't need fixing.

[spqrzilla]

These Your Gun Sucks articles are just lame as hell.